To link to this poem, put the URL below into your page: Song of Myself by Walt Whitman Walt Whitman: Song of Myself The DayPoems Poetry Collection, editor Click to submit poems to DayPoems, comment on DayPoems or a poem within, comment on other poetry sites, update links, or simply get in touch.. Poetry Whirl Indexes Poetry Places Nodes powered by Open Directory Project at dmoz.org DayPoems Favorites, a huge collection of books as text, produced as a volunteer enterprise starting in 1990. This is the source of the first poetry placed on DayPoems., exactly what the title says, and well worth reading.: 'If a guy somewhere in Asia makes a blog and no one reads it, does it really exist?' , miniature, minimalist-inspired sculptures created from industrial cereamics, an art project at Lewis and Clark College in Portland, Oregon., More projects from Portland, Furby, Eliza, Mr_Friss and Miss_Friss., a Portland, Oregon, exhibit, Aug. 5, 2004, at Disjecta. D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s * D a y P o e m s Won't you help support DayPoems? Song of Myself By 1819-1892 1 I celebrate myself, and sing myself, And what I assume you shall assume, For every atom belonging to me as good belongs to you.

I loafe and invite my soul, I lean and loafe at my ease observing a spear of summer grass. My tongue, every atom of my blood, form'd from this soil, this air, Born here of parents born here from parents the same, and their parents the same, I, now thirty-seven years old in perfect health begin, Hoping to cease not till death. Creeds and schools in abeyance, Retiring back a while sufficed at what they are, but never forgotten, I harbor for good or bad, I permit to speak at every hazard, Nature without check with original energy. 2 Houses and rooms are full of perfumes, the shelves are crowded with perfumes, I breathe the fragrance myself and know it and like it, The distillation would intoxicate me also, but I shall not let it. The atmosphere is not a perfume, it has no taste of the distillation, it is odorless, It is for my mouth forever, I am in love with it, I will go to the bank by the wood and become undisguised and naked, I am mad for it to be in contact with me.

* * * * *Given the number of GIMP experts who visit this site, it's not surprising to find that even the most obscure peril films, photos, art and literature usually can be identified by someone or other. Thanks to the recent discussion initiated by SIM Researcher, I remembered I once borrowed a library copy of Sadism in the Movies myself over 40 years ago.

A hedge is an investment position intended to offset potential losses or gains that may be incurred by a companion investment. In simple language, a hedge is used to. Official Tickets and Your Source for Live Entertainment. By clicking Next, you agree to the AXS. Terms and Conditions. You may opt out of these. Feb 19, 2013. Poor Righteous Teachers - Black Business (1993) 320kbps. Country: USA (New Jersey) Released: 1993. Label: Profile Records Quality: 320kbps. Duration: 52:18. Tracklisting: 1. Da Rill Shit 3. Nobody Move 4. Here We Go Again 6. Black Business 8. Get Off The Crack 9.

The text was dry as a bone, but some of the photos, though tame now, were pretty spicy for an impressionable teen GIMPer back then. Of course, at the time I didn't recognize any of the films from which the images were taken, but I'm surprised that after four decades of avidly following GIMP cinema, I still can't identify the examples posted here. Aside from the unknown frames in the SIM book, does anyone else have GIMP-oriented movie stills from films they can't identify? We all know of legendary titles which have vanished, but what about those from which only a tantalizing promo shot remains? No title; no identifiable talent; no way to track it down – but clearly some implied GIMP action. I'd love to see more of what's out there (though I suspect there isn't much), and perhaps some of the local old-timers might even recognize a scene or two. In part I've written this ambling pre-amble to justify posting my own mystery movie still (and I'm not even positive it's from a film, though it certainly looks like it).

I first saw this shot in a magazine decades ago, and just recently came across it in another forum. At a guess, it looks like it's from a mid 1970's softcore production. Based on the content, if this is from an extended scene, it could give the dungeon sequence in Poor Cecily a run for its money. Anyone know the source? * * * * * Poll: This one went up just before I left, and I ignored it because, to be honest, it confused the hell out of me. Seems I wasn't alone. In what alternate universe could a person who places a woman in peril ever be considered good (as in moral and righteous)?

“Good-guy GIMPer” – now there's an oxymoron for the ages. Maybe if the victim deserved it, but still, I don't think that's what the poll was about. After reading various re-interpretations of the question, I'm still not sure I'm on the right track, but I did grok a few more plausible alternatives. Access to kitchen and dull steak knife In my opinion, the individual tormenting the GIMP in any of these situations is going to be bad (as in evil). Even though perps in both camps may rationalize their behavior as being acceptable, necessary or even virtuous, I don't think Saint Peter would be impressed. The good news is that if any or all of these comparisons reflect the intent of the poll, it's easy for me to respond as in each case I'm on Team A. If I'm wrong, well there goes a spoiled ballot and I'm back to square one.

* * * * * Artists and collectors MadBob: You already know how much I like your image of the pneumatic Gallant Girl in peril of losing one of her, um super-powers, but I wanted to thank you publicly. Excellent work. Arcas: I know you're posting those blindfold-free renders to prove Ralphus wrong, and that's just fine with me. Like the little guy, I prefer to see the victim's eyes, so props for those last two pictures. Kathyrne: Great festive pic! I'm buying that set and counting down the days one dame at a time.

Covers: The more MAM covers you post, the more I miss these 'zines. Keep on coverin'. * * * * * Ralphus: Thanks for clipping the “Senora Acero” scene, but as with most television GIMP, there is so much wasted potential here. First off, Blanca clearly has a body to die for, but the director goes to ridiculous lengths to make sure we don't see much of it. Obviously, the woman's interrogators would rip off her clothing to remove the cash strapped to her body (did Martin “I-never-film-rapes” Scorsese watch this?), so why the hell is she shown fully clothed and not much worse for wear after the money is gone?

She must have been naked or nearly so at some point, so right – “let's take a quick break here and let our captive Miss Mexico get dressed before we knock the stuffing out of her”. And as Joanna has already mentioned, what sort of idiot interrogator would attach electrodes to the victim's wrists? I guess because they let her stay dressed, there wasn't much exposed skin left to use. And despite all the build-up and sophisticated hardware, the electro torture lasts a little over ten seconds in a seven minute clip that doesn't have much else to offer other than a lot of shouting, shaking and mild slapping around. What sells the scene is Blanca's looks and acting, but beyond that, it's just, well television. 4316) El Wananchi.

Hi, Fritz, Your last post (3415?) was very appropriate. You would be very hard pressed to qualify the guy performing the act as 'good' (someone came earlier with the 'lawful/chaotic' distinction, typical of D&D role playing! But they had to devise that because of the lack of a 'cultural background' to the game rules, that intends to be universal) That's why I put the stress on the victim. Except for some very particular cases, the victim of the 'A-team' is also a 'player' (a spy, assassin, mafia-girl, whatever), and knows that her activities entail the risk of being captured and put to torture. The victim of 'Team-B' is always 'an innocent bystander' (what we would have called 'a civilian').

Therefore, her position is much more unfair. Regards, El Wananchi 4317) covers. Ralphus - Thanks for posting the version of Senora Acero. I was very keen to see it as it deals with interrogation which is my top interest, but I couldn't view the original in my country. I think it is very good. Yes, of course, being a mainstream production it's not going to go as far as we would like, and I would LOVE to see her spreadeagled on a bench with those electrodes clipped to her nipples.

But on the plus side she is a total babe, and her performance is credible. I like the way she looks more disheveled as it goes on, and in my mind I can see what's going to happen to her after the camera leaves her - and it's not going to be pleasant for her.

Fortunately I can speak just enough Spanish to enjoy her begging. And Amy looks delicious in the daily pictures. @Arcas: That's such a hot! Love the details like the ripped stockings which means I must have put up a struggle when I was being captured or restrained or stripped and the smoke around the clips shows its some heavy voltage that I'm getting, and the gag means I'm not being put through an interrogation; someone just wants to se me in agony. The camera is very sinister; it could be for my captor's private use, or I'm part of a snuff film, or it's a live feed as part of a set up where people can bid online to watch abducted women being tortured, or it's some kind of revenge set up and someone I've gotten on the wrong side of has hired a professional to make me suffer and then have the film of it sent to them.

4323) Ralphus. Fritz wrote: Thanks for clipping the “Senora Acero” scene, but as with most television GIMP, there is so much wasted potential here.despite all the build-up and sophisticated hardware, the electro torture lasts a little over ten seconds in a seven minute clip that doesn't have much else to offer other than a lot of shouting, shaking and mild slapping around. Yeah, the actual shocking was relatively short, but all the buildup and her changing reactions.first defiant, then pleading and panicked as the shock box appears, and finally gasping and broken at the end.was exciting and dramatic stuff, especially because the actress is so beautiful. What sells the scene is Blanca's looks and acting, but beyond that, it's just, well television. It's television. You wouldn't go to a pizza joint and expect to be served steak and lobster, would you?

In the same vein, you can't really expect nudity and electrodes on the nipples on television. There are always going to be limitations in a medium that is designed to be consumed by the masses. The kind of scene I'm sure you wanted to see (and Osouk too, and probably most of us) just isn't possible for TV. To get that, you'd have to go with ZFX or one of your customs from PKF.

Most TV GIMPage is pretty lame, but this scene, and also the recent Yvonne Stahovski scene on '24', were the exceptions to the rule. This was actually a really good scene, and what made it stand out was because it was both good AND on television, albeit foreign television. Osouk wrote: I like the way she looks more disheveled as it goes on, and in my mind I can see what's going to happen to her after the camera leaves her - and it's not going to be pleasant for her. Good call on the disheveled part. Check out these stills, the first from the beginning of the scene, and the second at the end.

About Dead But Dreaming was published today. A must read for her fans. Here's a sample of the exchange between Mike Haberfelner and Amy: features a few scenes that would be way out of the comfort zone of most actresses I know (and of course I'm especially referring to the public nude flogging here) - so what goes through your mind when shooting scenes like these, and how do you prepare for them mentally? And how do you feel watching yourself in them, actually? In scenes like this, I’m thinking about my part, if everything looks right, and sometimes about the weather.

It's not easy to be out in the hot sun, or extreme cold, without clothes. My main concern is always that we get the shots we need for the film, that it looks believable, artistic, and amazing, the best it can be. I prepare for these scenes like I do any other, I arrive on set and get into character.

Although, I also bring a bathrobe for the nude scenes. And my thermos.

And sunscreen. I have a hard time watching myself in these scenes, it's a different experience than shooting. I tend to over-empathize with my character.

In the premiere, you can see me in the back row, cringing. 4329) Daniel.

Just popped in after a long hiatus to announce the further death of UK porn. The anti-porn fascists there have added these to the list of acts that British producers can’t show: • Spanking • Caning • Aggressive whipping • Penetration by any object 'associated with violence' • Physical or verbal abuse (regardless of if consensual) • Water sports • Female ejaculation • Strangulation • Facesitting • Fisting This is obviously a ludicrous list.

Consent is not an issue. The prudes decide what is 'associated with violence,' whatever the hell that means.

This is sadly a disturbing sign of the times. The full story is — GIMP poll: Gotta go with B (bad guys). They're unpredictable, more dangerous and often more creative than interrogators, and the constant threat of death should elicit a better reaction from the victim. Also, interrogators don't gag their victims because, well, they're interrogators, and I need a good gag to complete the scene.

4332) Brutus. In post 4331, Brutus wrote ' Just popped in after a long hiatus to announce the further death of UK porn. The anti-porn fascists there have added these to the list of acts that British producers can’t show: •Spanking •Caning •Aggressive whipping •Penetration by any object 'associated with violence' •Physical or verbal abuse (regardless of if consensual) •Water sports •Female ejaculation •Strangulation •Facesitting •Fisting Well, I for one welcome the new alien overlords of England! There's only so much spanking, caning, and aggressive whipping that one man can stomach. Now perhaps the UK porn producers can finally up the ante by bringing us more rack stretching, iron branding, witch dunking in the Thames, and roasting over fire whilest chained to a rotisserie! For too long we've been subjected to the same ol', same ol'.

Now the studios will have truly been given the freedom to be as dark and depraved as ever, now that the burden of light bondage has been removed. And if the Brits can't rush to bring this new product to market, I'm sure the Germans, Czechs, Hungarians, and Japanese will.

To the British porn censors I say well done and huzzah! Unfortunately, it also means ShackledMaidens will no longer be able to sell pictures like the one above, so get yours while you can. 4340) Thomas Chaser. El Wananchi: Like you, I prefer that the victim be as you put it, “a player”, who is at least partially responsible for the peril in which she finds herself. However, I don't agree that completely innocent GIMPs can't find themselves at the hands of Team A villains. I have enjoyed many interrogation scenes, public punishments and discipline meted out on women who were the victims of mistaken identity or just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

And that doesn't include the guilt-free casualties of pogroms and state-sanctioned torture. There's more diversity on Team A than people may think. Sophie: Welcome to the board!

We're glad to have you here. I'd like to see some other works from you. -------------------------------------- Brutus: Whoa, I did a double-take when I saw your name. Great to see you back here. You know, people have asked me in the past who my favorite reviewer is and my answer has always been 'Brutus.' I checked; the last time you were here was back in January of 2012.way too long ago. I knew things were restrictive in the UK and I figure that might have had some effect on your accessing the site.

Dude, I'm glad I live in the US. Yeah, things were rough for our freedoms when Bush when was in office but they've lightened up the past 6 years. But nothing compared to this latest travesty in the UK. Is there a way to vote these conservative clowns out of office?

You also wrote: Gotta go with B (bad guys). They're unpredictable, more dangerous and often more creative than interrogators, and the constant threat of death should elicit a better reaction from the victim. Also, interrogators don't gag their victims because, well, they're interrogators, and I need a good gag to complete the scene. You know, those are some great reasons for voting for the 'bad guys'. The threat of death is a good one. Not to mention that a victim of the 'good guys' can stop the torture any time just by speaking up.

And you're right about the gags. Bad guys don't want their victims to make noise so they keep them gagged, which automatically takes away the woman's last line of defense.her ability to speak. So she couldn't stop the torture even if she wanted to. Plus gagging her makes her look so much better! But if you're voting Bad Guys, you better speak up soon because your side is losing.

Here's the latest poll results: GIMP POLL: What's your preference as far as antagonists in BDSM films go? A) 'Good guys' (ie Inquisition films, films involving corrupt law enforcement/spy interrogation films, etc) 26 votes B) 'Bad guys' (kidnappers, serial rapists/killers etc) 15 votes -------------------------------------- Bronx_Warrior: Nice animated gifs; that's something new from you. But can we give the Black Ribbon pics a rest? I counted; you've posted 26 stills from that movie so far this year. We need to find you a new favorite movie! -------------------------------------- JD wrote: Long time listener, first time caller.

What is this, talk radio? Also, glad to have you here, but you'll need a new handle since we already have a JD here. And just in case you're wondering, you can't have Ralphus, either; that's taken, too. And third.helluva find on that Hello Ladies clip! But what a tease. I kept watching it over and over hoping that glitch would go away and we'd see some real boobage.

Foiled again. BTW, was anybody else curious to see what was burning off to the side of the woman and pouring out all that smoke (above)? It added a nice ambiance to the scene, anyway. -------------------------------------- Lastly, below is a gift from our friend Pedro. I know everyone here is starting to get Olalla Fever, but for those of us who couldn't get enough of Nancy, Roxane and the other girls from History of Pain: Inquisition, here's a very cool 'behind the scenes' look at the making of the production. I don't know about you guys, but I could never get bored looking at those 3 beautiful girls in various stages of nudity and bondage.

It's a nice piece of work. Sophie - love the ambiance in your picture Having the victim in the background forces our attention to what's happening in the foreground and all of the instruments that may or may not be used on the poor girl. It's an interesting approach to a fairly common bondage position and one that's not commonly seen. I can't say I don't wish the victim was a bit more available for study, but I like the artistic approach you took to presenting the piece. If there's one criticism I'd like to offer, its that she seems a bit too much endowed for her frame. If you shrank her back to a more petite B-cup, people might have a harder time identifying it as a poser piece. 4346) Alvin Yap.

I'm unsure whether some people even still truly get what the poll meant by 'good guys'. It's been discussed into the ground but I thought it was made clear that it was far from literal and just worded that way as the poll maker lacked the proper D&D alignment titles. It's really only two different kinds of bad.hell it's really only one specific kind of bad (chaotic evil) vs a couple of the other kinds (from lawful to neutral) from what I've seen. It really wasn't even fair.

Those thinking the 'good' is limited to anything really haven't consudered the scope of what lawful evil can do. If the mafia boss demands it the mooks better damn well be shoving something in her mouth. Must be trying to achieve a goal and not really doing it for the pleasure? The Evil McEvil Empire that revels in sadistic perversions associated with toying with thier invaded and conquered slaves seems to disagree. Fact is the 'Good' vote is both of these guys.and many more. The only side really restricted to certain behaviors is the 'Bad'.

Again.the poll isn't actually very fair. The only reason it was no landslide at first I think was the confusing options. Delphi Xe Serial Port Component Repair. Yes: I tried to find words to communicate my appreciation for your art, but I know none that sock straight to the solar plexus quite the way your visions have struck me. The best I've got is grunt: 'GRRRR!'

Because that's the only way I know how to romanize the gloriously visceral, stomach-dropping, breathtaking, jaw-dropping feeling I got when my eyes fixed upon the latest from both of you. Frankly, it's torture. Because your visions spark technicolor life into my otherwise dull, vague fantasy impressions. Yes, you both pose complete, stunningly detailed and gloriously idiosyncratic scenes unto themselves; but they also invite (no, demand) the dynamic context of which they're one moment's freeze frame. 'IMAGINE MY STORY!'

They bark--no doubt the same tone in which the interrogator demands TALK. In fact: Arcas, of all your recent DAZ masterpieces, the image you posted on 8 November ([]) pushes my metaphysical buttons with most savage savvy. How does that skipped heartbeat land when the page scrolls and my eyes land on that image? What does my allegorical 'GRRRR!' Save having a mirror with me while flicking my iPad screen, I'd bet it'd pass for hers. Which brings me to the other delicious twist in the latest of the Arcas oeuvre: Joanna.

Sure, her Poser-approved likeness is on fire--figuratively and literally; but it's the 'tude-rich context that really winds my kink up to the 'breathless' setting. Just one peril ago, the featured Arcas depiction had her spitting recalcitrantly in her captor's face; this time, it's all about how many amperes she can take.

What to make of a woman with a list of malcontented pursuers so deep, darkly talented, and well-equipped? And clearly--so her captors routinely discover--she's a strong one: yes, they extort grunts, shrieks, gnashing teeth and balled fists... But we have *never* seen Joanna beg. I can't be the only one out there chomping at the bit for a little fiction ( are you out there, Eda?

Perhaps another glorious Arcas-Eda mashup?) that fleshes out one of the many possible stories behind our little group's resident international woman of mystery. 4354) Covers.

I don't know why you guys think gags and interrogation are exclusive. You put a gag into a babe's mouth and tell her it will be 2 hours before you take it out, and she better think carefully about how she answers your questions then. And later you listen to her begging and pleading and swearing she's told you everything she knows as you force the gag back in and tell her this time it will be 4 hours before you ask her again.

Maybe a bit late for the poll, but I would have to go with the 'good' guys. I like the idea of total desperation, and the thought that she's completely helpless and there's no chance of rescue, as the men that should be rescuing her are the exact same men pumping electrcity through her genitals is very arousing. I also like the fact that it's a battle of wills - she thinks she might be able to end it by telling them what they want, or convincing them she doesn't know anything. But of course the gang rapes and torture will continue no matter what she does, for days or weeks without end.

I'll echo Fritz' comments about Team A's use of gags. An example: if the GIMP in question is a POW, no doubt she has committed violations of camp rules. Such as communicating between cells or cell blocks. Such blatant violations of prison regulations cannot go unpunished. She's stripped, hands cuffed behind her, sat in leg irons on her bunk, then gagged and blindfolded for 30 days.

(based on how the NVN actually punished POWs in Hanoi for communicating.) There are opportunities for gags in Team A's tool kit, and they have their place. 4358) fumetto. Arcas, I must apologize to you as I am one of the multitude of quiet art appreciators in the audience. I have enjoyed material from you whenever I see it but have never taken the time to tell you. There are numerous artists I have enjoyed the works of over the years in our twisted corner of the universe but only certain ones that really push my buttons--and you are one of them. Sophie, you are new to me but I can see your work really has promise.

I am looking forward to great things from you. I love the attention to detail in what I have seen thus far.

Kathyrne, your work is different but exciting nonetheless, especially for folks like me who are hung up on large breasts. One can use your art as a good jumping off point for some darker personal fantasies.

Thank you all for your efforts. I am certain there are many like me who truly enjoy what we see. It raises our temperatures AND our.' Only partially as a pun I say 'Keep it up!'

I wholeheartedly agree with Megan's assessment on art seen. I also agree with her on the need for more good stories. Osouk had referenced stories, too. In that regards, I promised Ralphus I would be checking into my archives to find some old favorite stories I have saved and send them to him to post. I will try to get that done soon to share with all of you. 4369) Joanna.

First, late to the poll question. But for me the answer is good guys. If the good guys (government officials,etc) are doing the torture the GIMP will feel much more helpless.

I mean who can she call? To me the key is helplessness, no rescue teams about to burst thru the door. I like it when the girl feels hopeless or at least acts that way. Now a quick movie review. I rented the movie Kite from Netflix. I thought it had some excellent GIMP possibilities and the star (India Eisley) redefines smoking hot. She played Shailene Woodley's sister (probably one of the biggest female commodities in Hollywood right now along with Jennifer Lawrence) on the show 'The Secret Life of the American Teenager'.

An interesting show if you watched it with the mute button on. Anyway the plot of Kite is a young girl in the future whose parents were killed by the bad guys (dad was a cop) grows up and goes out to seek here parents killers. It is based on a adult comic book in the vein of Sin City. Sadly as a GIMP movie I would rate it a mild disappointment. It had two scenes with some real GIMP value. In one she is surprised while trying to help a girl escape a slavery ring and hit with a pipe in the stomach, she proceeds to take a 5 on one beating with multiple stomach punches that leaves her unconscious.

A good scene but a bit too quick. The one other scene she is captured and zip tied to a deep fryer. The bad guys want to get information from her. She takes a punch in the face which bloodies her nose, has an earring pulled out, and then the bad guys try to burn her hand in the deep fryer. She manages to escape. Now while the GIMP scenes were marginal at best.

The fights were realistic, her reactions were excellent, and she takes some punches in almost every encounter. Unlike a lot of female super hero types the action is believable, to some extent, and not the typical hero isn't in danger crap we often see from female protagonists.

And she is a girl that looks unbelievably hot in an almost illegal way. All in all a great movie, but a mediocre gimp flick. My grade for GIMP mainstream a C- but worth the rent.

One other note to all the downloaders here today. There was a gang rape scene of Adelade Kane in last night's 'Reign' on the CW. It was a very good scene by mainstream TV standards. I'd love to have caps and a video of that if anyone caught it. 4372) Nancyfan. Daniel wrote: Thank you Kathyrne, Covers and Fumetto for a dazzling display this morning!! Sloth wrote: Covers - always had a fondness for that Mel Crair cover from the Aug 66 Man's Book - from the first time I saw it I formulated the sick twisted concept that it was a scene from a Volkswagen factory testing a vehicle safety restraint device under morbid Nazi supervision - love it.

Kathyrne wrote: @ Covers, really liked today's image! Awesome stuff. Wink Fritz wrote: Covers: The more MAM covers you post, the more I miss these 'zines.

Keep on coverin'. Thanks for all the love folks! It's always interesting when I post something that I think is nothing special and there is a sudden shower of appreciation. Intellectually, I know that everyone has different tastes. If I post something from my top 1% and there is no response, I don't even notice.

That's just the way of the internet. However, it still surprises me when I get a big response for something I see as merely run of the mill. It makes me wish for a voting system (ala Reddit) on my web site (bcotd.com) and the GIMP, just so I could see the range of opinions on each post. Today's MAM cover is from Man's Book Aug 1967. 4374) Reine Margot. With the title Kite and the review Id read I'd wager it's based on the same titled anime, not a comic book or manga. As far as it goes.I'm personally surprised they made it.

The original animation was technically Hentai and featured a couple of rape scenes that fell under quite a bit of heat when it first came out.given the character was drawn to appear almost crossing the line of underaged. That said, I'm almost happy they didn't adapt it to 100% accuracy even as a GIMPer given that sort of stuff doesn't belong in any medium, animated or otherwise.

Sophie wrote: (one thing, this type of forum is very unfamiliar to me. How does one quote/reply?) Our method is a little old fashioned. Essentially, when posting your comments, you type in the person who said it (eg., Sophie wrote:) and then put it in bold. That is followed by a copy and paste of the quote itself, which some of us like to put in italics. And then you type in your reply. Crude but effective. --- This column in the Globe and Mail in Canada is a bit tongue in cheek, but I'm sure we can all agree with her conclusions about the U.K.'

S wrongheaded censorship measures: [] 4380) elkcreek. In Post 4377, HP asks 'The full link leads to something called 'missing-full-lenght-film' (yes, that's how they spell length).

It gets disturbing toward the end, but it sure is intense. Question: What is it from? Was the actress in anything else?' HP, that has all the production value of a 'one and done' amateur film made by a couple for themselves using a home movie camera. I will say, however, that it is ambitious in its escalation and the woman certainly does her part to push her pain threshold. I mean, nailing her tits to the block of wood was intense, and then adding a gas heater on top of that? She gets my respect for doing that.

I thought the fire/branding scene would be about as far as they would go, because she's obviously in distress during that part, and then they added the tit nailing on top of that. Anyway, I can't help you with identifying any of the people associated with the film, but thanks for asking the question because (a) that shit was hard, and (b) there was a link on that page to one of my favorite HOM movies featuring my favorite HOM actress: 'House of Correction' with Nikki Dial. Good stuff and worth a watch. Anyway, here's a still from 'Missing Full Lenght Movie'.

While we're on the topic of GIMP scenes in recent TV shows, IDK if anybody has pointed these out, but Salem and Penny Dreadful had a few scenes recently. Salem E10 involves several scenes of torture/interrogation on a tabletop spread throughout the episode. E11 involves the same interrogator splashing boiling water on two other victims. Scenes are fairly lengthy but mostly dialog, not a lot of actual action (as is expected for TV). Penny Dreadful E5 involves a main character being locked into an insane asylum and subjected to ice bath, hosing, and some sort of brain surgery. The surgery was a little troubling, but the first two bits were quite good.

Please help to identify this clip: I accidentally discovered this short clip, which seems to be a compilation cut from a longer show. It seem to be quite unique, because it depicts real whipping and real 'rape' penetration before a real audience. Does anybody know the title of the show, or any link which shows the uncut version? Hint: There is no talking during the show, but at the very beginning of the clip someone tells: Action in a french dialect, so the origin country may be France, Belgium or Canada? Just guessing. 4386) Flintstone. Okay, now that the technical bugs are out of the way, on with the stuff that everyone else cares about.

Elkcreek: Nice review of Kite, thanks for letting us know about it. You're right, India Eisley is bleepin' gorgeous. I looked her up, her mom is Olivia Hussey, who was quite a babe herself when she was a teenager in Romeo and Juliet. So she definitely has good genes. Here's the link for your review.. This looks good; I added it to my Netflix queue. ------------------------------------------ HP: Your Mystery Movie is Cindy Prince 7 from B&D Pleasures.

Cindy and her husband John Prince made a lot of these videos back in the 1980s; they were released on video in the 1990s and I bought nearly all of them. Those guys got a lot of my money back in the day. They had million dollar ideas but hundred dollar production values. The video quality was never that good, but what they lacked in technical expertise they made up with imaginative torture scenarios. Back when the Republicans were in the White House and most bondage was deliberately toned down, these guys were putting out scenarios involving stuff like needles in the breasts, cigarette burning and fire torture (a major SHWING! For this pervert). In fact, Cindy even got burned at the stake twice in their videos.

No wonder I was hooked. After I watched enough of their videos, I began to realize the tricks they were using to produce these illusions. As a result, I think some of the mystique wore off, but every video I got from them had at least one scene that I kept on my highlights tapes.

You can get the whole Cindy Prince catalogue at, just type in Cindy Prince and everything comes up. 4388) Sophie. Thanks Ralphus and Flintstone for the ID of Cindy Prince. I thought I knew about the great stars, but either I never knew about her or somehow forgot. She seems to have been an amazing painslut, but what you say about the production values is all too true. Also, I'm one of those who prefers it when the torture leads up to sex, not just more torture.

But everyone's got their own ideas. While I'm here, does anyone know who the enema girl is in another video on the same site, with the same bad production values? It's at this link: [] Looks almost like Cindy, but not quite.

And thanks again for the expert info. The Reign scene is really not that graphic. It's quite short with frequent cuts and camera angles seemingly specifically chosen to avoid nudity.

I think the complaints might be more because it was aired right when the media happened to be talking about sexual assault on college campuses. If it had aired a month ago, I don't think there would have been nearly as much outcry. It might also be because it's on a 'basic' channel as opposed to a paid channel. For anybody looking for the scene, you can simply torrent the entire episode. TV eps are extremely easy to find online.

Search for Reign S02E09. 4400) Ralphus.

The Reign rape scene: Yeah, not that explicit. Kudos for the sexy cuteness of the victim, however. And for this pre-rape exchange of of dialogue after she's knocked down to the floor: 'Sovereign, she's a queen!' 'Well, she doesn't look like a queen now, does she?' BTW, I would NOT recommend attempting to torrent the episode, unless you want a bunch of nasty malware inadvertently downloaded to your computer. Instead, the show is available free for streaming off the CWTV website at the link below. The fun stuff starts around 29 minutes into the episode, if you don't mind sitting through about 15 minutes worth of commercials to get there.

4401) elkcreek. I wouldn't call the rape scene in Reign 'explicit', but then explicit is pretty much impossible on network TV and for that matter always has been.

But, by network TV standards it may be the most graphic rape scene I've seen for a couple of reasons. One, they showed the rape itself and the girl's reaction.

Almost every other rape scene I've seen on TV, might show the violence leading up to the scene but they cut away during the actual rape. I don't recall anyone I've seen including some of the better 70's scenes. And second, this was the main character of the show.

There have been other rapes on TV that were more violent, the rape of Stephanie Kramer on Hunter for instance, but none that I recall that actually showed a girl getting held down and assaulted thru the assault. I do think this scene is different. And yes you're right Adelaide Kane is hot, that doesn't hurt. Is there a way to get that clip off a streaming video? I suspect I don't have the tech savvy to do it. Oh, I agree, don't torrent, torrents are Malware City, you might as well just give all your passwords to a Nigerian prince.

4402) Sophie. In Post 4402, Sophie wrote 'You guys probably already know this, but there is a fantastic 'special' from Elite Pain called History of Torture - the Inquisition.

They even have a fake 'medical expert' providing extra details! Highly recommended!' See, I'm not the only one that thought this film was excellent! Sophie obviously has good taste. Ralphus gave it a 'B', and to each his own, but for me this film hit the right chords without slipping over into ridiculousness.

What I'd really like to see is 'History of Pain 3: Roman Empire' with whipping, bastinado, enslavement with a collar, and a crucifixion. Hopefully they'll find a good cast to compliment Roxanne so that she won't have to carry the load so much. Well yes, fake torrents can contain lots of malware. It's pretty easy to spot the sketchy torrents (and other online downloads). For starters, I'm pretty sure you can't actually imbed software into a video file, so anything that downloads directly as a video file (.wmv,.avi,.mp4, etc) is probably safe. Additional files that download would not be able to trigger unless you click on them, so.

Just don't click on them. Zip or.rar files are more sketchy, since you don't know what's in them. Anything that includes any sort of.exe file or any file that automatically opens is more then likely harmful. For torrents specifically, anything with very high seeder and leechers is probably safe, and one can review the comments section on the page for any fishiness. I've torrented a great many things for a good decade or so, never had any trouble for any torrents with >100 seeders or so.

IK this is pretty off topic, just wanted to point it out. 4408) A Canadian. Elkcreek: I use BitTorrent as the client and I like katproxy.com as the torrent site. I believe it's the same thing as kickass.to, just a mirror site. As for as the files go, I just go by number of seeds. For the Reign episode mentioned previously, the top one has like 4000 seeds currently ().

You can also see that it has 100 upvotes and 0 downvotes, which is another good way to gauge whether it's legit or not. This is mainly useful for popular/mainstream things, since smaller audience media obviously is going to have a larger tendency to be sketchy.

4411) elkcreek. Elk, I don't know what to say, I've used BitTorrent hundreds of times and I haven't had any malicious files or my firewall/antivirus quarantine anything off (I've used Kaspersky, ESET, and McAfee before, not at the same time obviously) ever since I restricted myself to torrents with 50+ seeders and minimal downvotes. I have to get to start work very early daily so I can't really watch TV and I don't have a DVR, so I grab the TV episodes I want to watch the day after off the web. Downloading mainstream shows with 50+ seeds, my rate of getting malicious software is literally 0%. I have no idea what you're doing that's triggering all those security alerts and whatnot, this is really puzzling to me. Anyways, I'm throwing the file onto mediafire right now (hopefully you can use that?) but looks like it'll take about 15m to upload. Nope That Reign scene must have been pretty damn good as much as the Politically Correct crowd is whining and crying about it.

Maybe I saw the middle eastern edition of the scene, but I don't see it graphic or explicit at all. Not a hint of skin. The only fact I see is that it depicts a rape in a very soft way. I don't know how it could be softer. If a depiction of rape makes whining and crying, then what happens if (God help!) someone would be killed in a TV show.

Or is rape so much worse than that? You only go in Mexico for a week and when you return, your nick you hijacked has been hijacked, the poll options has been clarified to add to further confusion and in UK they propose that there would be no more light BDSM and rain. Where is this world going to? It's a Mad, Mad World. Therefore, following Prince and Shia LaBeouf, I'll be further known as JD the second.

I expect that any JD nick lover to use 'the third', 'the fourth' and so forth. Only the original JD should be allowed the plain designation (with supporting evidence). @Herr Fritz: I'm constantly LMAO reading your sparring (and sadly mismatched) battle of wits with our esteem host, praised be His name. Please, stop. I read this forum to satiate my kinky needs, not to be entertained.

Please understand, I'm a very serious kink. To veer it ontopic, here's a picture completely unrelated with anything that I found online and kind of like it. 4418) Ralphus. JD (one of them, anyway) wrote: @Herr Fritz: I'm constantly LMAO reading your sparring (and sadly mismatched) battle of wits with our esteem host, praised be His name.

Aw, don't tell him to stop. It's one of my joys in life to constantly beat Fritz in whatever astute challenge he may throw my way. I've never lost an argument to him but he likes to keep on trying to beat me. He's sort of like the Washington Generals to my Harlem Globetrotters, a worthy opponent but always destined to end in defeat. 4419) A Canadian. Hey everyone!

So glad you're enjoying the pictures of yours truly at the top of the forum. BIG thanks to Ralphus for the promotion! Another fantastic review of Olalla just came out, this time from writer C. Dean Andersson, author of Torture Tomb! I'm traveling right now, so I haven't had time to stop in that often. Will be checking in about every other day.

In the meantime, Margot has everything covered. Announcement: All DVDs of Olalla have been shipped out as of December 4th, most people are getting theirs now, depending on your location. We are now shipping to the USA and Europe without delays. Just had to stop in after watching Olalla. Another fine film, though no doubt too odd and arty-fartsy for some. And I have to say that from a GIMP perspective, I was totally surprised by something.

Like everyone else awaiting the film, I knew there was a big BATS scene coming at the end. But I had no idea that it would be preceded by a fairly long and intense public flogging scene.

A scene that damn near rivals the one in Dead But Dreaming. Seriously folks, if public floggings excite you and you were thinking you’d pass on Olalla because you’re not into BATS scenes, you’re making a big mistake. Amy’s reactions during this scene are the best expressions of agony she’s ever given us. If her screams in previous efforts have left you less than 100% convinced, I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised here.

It’s really quite an amazing (and utterly believable) performance. 4426) Covers. Okay, after nearly a month, I think we can bring this latest GIMP poll question to a close.

One of the best we've had in recent memory, albeit one of the most confusingly written, although I have to admit that was part of the reason why there was so much discussion about it. Here's the final results: GIMP POLL: What's your preference as far as antagonists in BDSM films go? A) 'Good guys' (ie Inquisition films, films involving corrupt law enforcement/spy interrogation films, etc) 28 votes B) 'Bad guys' (kidnappers, serial rapists/killers etc) 15 votes This turned out to be a landslide for the supposed 'good guys', nearly a 2-1 advantage. Thanks to all of you who voted and explained why you were choosing the side you did. I think you all made good points in your reasoning, and it also feels better telling your parents you want to pursue a career in law enforcement rather than becoming a serial killer. Just don't tell them the real reason why.

---------------------------------------- Sophie asked: Is it wrong of me to find very erotic? I guess the peril element is that now she is unconscious, all manner of unspeakable acts could be perpetrated on her helpless and vulnerable body. And they could, of course, all be photographed in great deal and shared with the world. I do understand the appeal of having an unconscious victim, but to me, that takes away all the fun. It's why Bill Cosby, Serial Rapist, will never be thought of in a positive light even by those pervs who like the idea of raping beautiful women.

If they're asleep, that's cheating, Bill! Do it like a real man and overpower them! If she's unconscious, it would be like having sex with one of those RealDolls (although to be fair, they're doing some pretty amazing work on them nowadays). I want her there to be squirming and reacting to what I do to her. I know there's a whole subfetish devoted to the Sleepy Girl thing, but it leaves me scratching my head as to why people like it. Maybe they like the sex thing but prefer to not have any kind of communication with their victim?

I guess that makes as much sense as anything else. And I'm a Torture Guy, so having her unconscious would defeat the whole purpose. If she's not responding when I'm shocking her nipples, what fun is that? I dunno, maybe I'm just off-base on this one. I'd like to hear some alternate viewpoints. Anyone else have an opinion on the subject? 4429) MadBob.

Ralphus wrote: If she's unconscious, it would be like having sex with one of those RealDolls (although to be fair, they're doing some pretty amazing work on them nowadays). Gosh, I admit I was totally unaware of the technological progress happened on the sex dolls front.

But the price is just INSANE! (IMO) I want her there to be squirming and reacting to what I do to her.And I'm a Torture Guy, so having her unconscious would defeat the whole purpose. If she's not responding when I'm shocking her nipples, what fun is that? I dunno, maybe I'm just off-base on this one. I'd like to hear some alternate viewpoints. Anyone else have an opinion on the subject? I'm 100% with you on that.

I sometimes like to have my victims blindfolded and/or gagged, especially because -during a torture session - they don't know what is about to hit them (or, they can try to guess it from the surrounding noises), and I find this HIGHLY exciting. But totally unconscious is not my thing at all. 4430) Bill K. I saw the Olalla bats scene and I've got to say Amy is hot and this woman is on fire. Literally she on fire this time which means the bush fire alert symbol has been posted.

The acting in the bats scene was fantastic from Amy and this time lots of firewood and flames compared to the Maleficarum bats which I never got the visual look that Amy was actually on fire burning. The whipping and tenderizing of Amy before the fire was set was a good call too. Overall the bats scene made the movie. As for the bed bound raping scene was well, that was it for the gimp scenes in the entire movie. I can only rate the movie Bats scene an 'A' and for the other parts of movie, I've got to say I was spoiled by Maleficarum's non stop whipping, roasting and torturing scenes so I expected see some of the same type gimp scenes in Olalla than there was.

Couldn't Amy slowly eat a couple women too between the couple of clueless guys she ate at least? For the lack of gimp scenes I can't give the rest of the movie a rating at all. Still Amy, keep that bats look in your next bats movie but think clothed bats next time and much more pre whipping and torture scenes also. Thank you very much for the Olalla bats movie. 4433) fumetto. Fumetto: I appreciate that you want to contribute, but flooding the forum with 10 images at once is not the best way to do it. I turned your 10 posts into one; people can still see the images full-sized if they click on the thumbs.

Please contact me in the future if you plan on doing that again and I can help you. ---------------------------------------------------- jerseydevil: Regarding the Snidely Whiplash series, I've been in contact with Oslo Netfetter and I'm awaiting a follow-up reply from him as far as a source for the remaining files I may be missing. I think he only checks his mail about once a month.

---------------------------------------------------- In case not everyone checks the databases on a regular basis, here's a recently added entry to both the Torture Rack and Hot Iron databases. It's the Ralphus Edit of the 1975 classic The Inquisitor, filled with rack torture, brandings, whippings, lots of bare boobs and even a burning at the stake for Bill K and other BATS freaks. They don't make 'em like this anymore. 4438) J Scourge. SCOURGE'S SOAPBOX The Scream Is Still the Same - part 1 Today's news is about the Senate reporting the CIA use of torture. But no matter your take on it, that's reality and totally different than what we come here for.

This is OUR escapism and it's what we enjoy. What really pushes your buttons sexually is often quite different from one person to the next. This is true regardless of where you fall on the vanilla to kinky scale. When does fantasy cross into reality? What is your take on consensual versus non-consensual? Some of this can be a male or female thing of course while some depends upon the degree of dom or sub in your makeup (or if you even wear make-up I suppose.but I digress). Do you have a deep-seeded sadistic streak running through you secretive or otherwise?

Perhaps you are really more of a masochist or maybe a closet masochist. With a twist on the upcoming holiday season, 'Is it better to give than to receive?'

There are certainly some of those in the audience who partake of the real thing when it comes to the large variety of what fits under the BDSM umbrella but for the most part, those who partake of the GIMP Forum are more viewers than doers. At the same time there are those who never come here but find themselves getting a certain titillation by certain 'girls in peril' scenarios--just ones that are not too severe. These folks feel a need to draw the line before things go too far.

I think this crowd limits their fantasies and in so doing restricts their enjoyment of where their fantasies could take them. Those who frequent The GIMP Forum and similar venues are a more unusual group to be sure but I also believe are more honest with themselves than those who have secret lusts and dreams of domination but only partake of more 'acceptable' mainstream media approaches to damsels in distress. Those are the people who enjoy seeing the heroine running desperately away from the madman out to do her untold harm with the hope she will escape his clutches--and manage to succeed. That's as far as they will allow their arousal to take them. These same folks would be aghast at the prospect of women held against their will let alone tortured although I firmly believe there are a lot more that find themselves excited by some of these dark areas than will truly admit--even to themselves!

Readers of this forum and similar sites have all found themselves attracted to the fantasy of women being abducted, stripped, enslaved, forced to do things against their will, chased through the jungle, made to work in fields, mines and as galley slaves. Fantasies abound of rope, chains and leather; women being racked, shocked, branded, whipped, flogged.and dare I say, ' scourged.' There are some that will fantasize the horrors of rape while others will imagine crucifixions, hangings, beheadings and witch burnings. This is all connected to how our particular libido is wired, just a little different than what is considered 'the norm.' There is nothing at all wrong with any of it as long as you can always recognize the difference between fantasy and reality.

Consider the fact that there is a huge audience for murder mysteries but just because you read one does not mean you are going to go out and kill someone. Neither do I believe anyone here at the GIMP Forum views girls in merciless peril and then runs out to abduct, torture and rape--at least not in real life. Our fantasy life, on the other hand, can get quite dark. We read stories, look at pictures and view videos all with the purpose of getting turned on by the suffering of one or more fantasy females.

None of this should be construed as misogynistic, as I do believe all here have the utmost respect for ladies in real life. Furthermore, the audience for this material is not 100% male, though it certainly appears to be predominately so. As we have seen, there truly are some women who enjoy fantasizing about other women being tormented while there are others who see themselves as the victim, imagining themselves on the receiving end of various tortures.

While the majority of the male audience connect with the tormentors, there are men who may do a reverse role in their head and imagine themselves in a dual role as both the tortured woman as well as the tormentor. Then there are the women who see themselves in both roles as well. We're all like 'perverted' grains of sand on a kinky beach. Interestingly, there are some women, who are very independent thinkers and count themselves among their feminist sisterhood who see nothing wrong with the seemingly contradictory position of seeing females attacked and subjected to physical atrocities.

Some see this as an acceptance of some of the extreme evils within our society while others may be attracted to it for it's sheer escapism all the while. Within this group is also the revenge crowd. These are the women (and certainly men as well) who, after witnessing the extreme atrocities of rape and torture suffered by the heroine of the story, applaud how she comes back to make her tormentors suffer even worse fates than she has gone through and triumphs in the end. It truly does take all kinds of folks to make up the world--in reality AND fantasy.

Human beings are quite diverse and there is no better examples of this then our kinky brethren. Ralphus, Thanks for the link to Inquisidor. You presented the best scenes of a movie that I had despaired of seeing again. It has almost all you could wish for: sweat, puncturing for Satan’s Mark, racks and bodies that look like they have been through hell.

There is also the rack scene with the blonde where her toes splay and point, this is a detail that is sometimes ignored. It is a pity the quality is not better and that some of the scenes are too short. It is also a pity that the blonde that gets away and does the Devil worship incantations did not fall in the hands of the Inquisitor. This is food for a series I have long thought about. Something like scenes you would like to see but were left out or interrupted. For example, when in the Pit and the Pendulum Vincent Price’s character promises his wife that she will be tortured to death and then the movie ends.

There are many more like that. 4440) Daniel. J Scourge: The real question is would any Gimpers watch a real woman live or on a video of a real women being tortured to death such as burnt alive especially slowly. No matter the method of torture and death but public execution and floggings were common until the late 1800th century all throughout human history.

It was enjoyed by all. In the medieval times the entire village people came to watch a witch be tortured and then hung, drowned and my favorite burned at the stake. What changed all that I wonder?

Let's say if the powers to be bought back public flogging and other tortures of convicted guilty women would you watch? Also public capital punishment would you watch? Both live or on TV.

Just saying most all people used to enjoy watching women being tortured and executed and thought nothing was wrong to do so. Much the same as we watched a sporting event now. I see nothing wrong with being a Gimper for that reason. 4442) JD (the second).

@ J Scourge: Exactly. My personal explanation to the persistance of kink in us is that we are (as mammals) products of millions of years of evolution and in nature the male is always horny and the female is always choosy and moody. So, sometime in the past, the aggressivity of the male in assaulting resisting women paid off and became an evolutionary advantage. A solid argument in favor of that idea is that there is similar plethora of 'deviant' sexual behaviours among the other mammalian members (from homosexuality to rough sex) as stated by countless sociobiologists in the last 30 years.

The caveat is that modern human got to learn to control these basic drives, in the same way we learned to control the basic fears and territorial urges. 4443) mr bush. In Post #4437, Ralphus wrote: 'In case not everyone checks the databases on a regular basis, here's a recently added entry to both the Torture Rack and Hot Iron databases. It's the Ralphus Edit of the 1975 classic The Inquisitor, filled with rack torture, brandings, whippings, lots of bare boobs and even a burning at the stake for Bill K and other BATS freaks.

They don't make 'em like this anymore.' Guilty as charged!

Although, in my defense, I already knew about this film. But what I didn't know was that Ralphus was such a decent editor. Now, if you were a great editor you would have edited out the slow parts, like the police poking around the charcoal remains and the weird discoteque sequence when the blonde girl is being stretched. But hey, you captured the mood of the pic so that counts for something, right?

Anyway, thanks for posting up that classic! 4447) Ralphus.

El Wananchi wrote: The blonde girl that escapes unscathed in 'El Inquisidor de Lima' is an Argentinean model and actress called Elena Sedova. Pity for she is the prettiest of the whole lot. Ah, thanks for the name, the IMDB was practically useless in this case.

You're right, she was gorgeous. It killed me to have to edit out her nude scene in the movie, because the editor intercut it with shots of the two women being tortured in the dungeon. I know some might argue that the footage of Elena undressing is the best part, but in this case, she was a distraction to the rest of the scene so she had to go. In fact, this film was hard to edit because in seemingly every torture scene they would cut away to unrelated shots, such as the girls watching a cockfight, dancing in a nightclub, frolicking on the beach, etc. Some of that I had to leave in because I didn't want to lose the all-important screaming. Of course, if you look at what was left, you've still got a solid 15 minutes of primo GIMP footage, and nearly all of it nude. I was pretty happy with how it all came out.

------------------------------------ Thomas Chaser wrote: Now, if you were a great editor you would have edited out the slow parts, like the police poking around the charcoal remains and the weird discoteque sequence when the blonde girl is being stretched. Well, I already explained why I had to leave in the girls dancing, and I definitely didn't want to lose the shots of the burned body after the BATS.

As a longtime collector of burning at the stake scenes, that was the ONLY time I've ever seen footage of the burned body after the scene. There was sort of a morbid fascination getting to see what a real BATS victim looked like, even though it was obviously not real and done for the movie. ------------------------------------ J Scourge: Excellent post, and what's this? This was only Part 1?

Well, if you've got more to say, then please, bring on Part 2! I think you pretty much nailed the whole readership of this board with your characterizations of what we are into with our dark fantasies and erotic tendencies. Some of us would probably fall into multiple categories.

And the whole question of how fantasy crosses into reality is especially intriguing. I liked Bill K's question and it sort of ties in with my earlier reply to Thomas Chaser. Let's expand it a bit and come up with a hypothetical situation and make this into an official poll question. GIMP POLL: Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you?

I think a number of people are going to refrain from answering because they don't want to admit the truth in a public forum, but I'll start by saying yes, I would. If you throw in the caveat that there's nothing we can do to prevent the event from happening, and also that the chances of this actually happening in today's society are practically nil, then yeah, that might make it easier to justify. Hell, most of dig seeing women tortured on film, and what is the often the number one reason why a scene doesn't work for us? It doesn't look real enough! Of course, in this case, we're going to be witnessing real suffering, but honestly, how is that different from watching an ElitePain or Mood Pictures video?

The girls are really being tortured in those and people buy those videos up left and right. Of course, when you expand it to execution, that's different. No one buys real snuff videos, but how many people watched the Saddam Hussein execution video on YouTube before they finally pulled it?

And remember, your not watching it will have no effect on what's going to happen.she's going to die anyway. Anyway, if you guys and gals are honest and brave enough to answer, this has the makings of a VERY interesting poll question. So step right up and give us your opinion. The only wrong answer is not to vote at all, so let's hear what you have to say. 4448) Bill K. The poll question: Unlike the last poll, there's no grey area in this one. In the immortal words of Freddie Mercury: No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

I think there are a number of flaws in Ralphus's reasoning. And his argument that you can't stop it and it's going to happen so you might as well go along with it sounds surprisingly NRA-like for Ralphus. But it's late so I'll skip the moral objections and focus on the main point.

I have no interest in seeing anyone get hurt. I enjoy watching fantasy scenarios where people are acting, but that's what I want to see -- acting, not the real thing. Part of what makes the best GIMP scenes enjoyable to me is the knowledge that they aren't real. I have never said I want my GIMP scenes to look 'real.' I have said I want them to look convincing.

That may sound like semantics but the difference is significant. When I use the word 'convincing,' I mean that a victim who is supposed to be helpless should look helpless. She shouldn't look like she could easily escape her plight. That's not the same thing as wanting it to look 'real.'

For example, I see no need to mess things up in a whipping scene by including buckets of blood. While a real-life whipping victim likely would be a bloody mess, I'm looking for erotic thrills, not realism. Ralphus raised a good point about the ElitePain and Mood Pictures films.

But, in fact, I don't watch those films because I don't care for the real thing. 4450) JD (the second).

I second to A Canadian on this one. Real pain is actually a turn off to me. A sanitized medieval fantasy can eliminate the stomach-turning real life stench of the dungeons and can make ugly bruises disappear. Kind of cherrypicking what works best for me. Frankly in real life I'd be worried to even get close to someone that actually enjoy real pain, like some of the people around here.

I'm ambivalent about the Hungarians' work exactly because it's real. I can only hope the models get paid a lot of money and this thought makes it bearable. My ideal video would be simulated but in a very professional way, using CGI and big budgets. And that's why I prefer mainstream media occasional bondage scenes to (semi)amateurish bondage short clips.

I could watch the Barbarian Queen II dungeon scene 100 times but I only watched History of Pain once (no offense Pedro). JD, le deuxieme 4451) J Scourge. It was good to see the responses so far to part 1 of my Scourge's Soapbox post. There really is so much to consider in what I was writing that I found myself editing my material quite a bit and determining the best approach was splitting it into parts. I do hope to continue with part 2 within the next week. In regards to the new poll question, as I stated, people who come here are fantasy-minded so if they are being honest I believe they would not be interested in seeing anyone really hurt regardless of if this were done with the approval of any governing body. I do love my fantasies and while I might imagine such a scenario, I would not really want to see another person tortured.

Of course if Dick Cheney would have his way, we could might see hi-def prime time torture sessions coming to your living room soon. 4452) Thomas Chaser. Poll question: Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you? My answer: This falls in the same category as safaris on small game preserves where the animals have no chance to escape; or real executions where due process has run out and the murderer gets his lethal injection/electric chair/hanging/firing squad. If there's no peril, there's no drama. By that I mean, the peril is the danger, but in danger is also the possibility of escape. If the outcome is certain, then it isn't dangerous; its a foregone conclusion.

The girl must be in peril. There must be a chance to escape the danger; to stop the pain. Just like in the previous poll question where the good guys put the girl in danger but also play by a set of rules that restrict their ability to inflict pain, so too I would not be inclined to watch a real torture session where there was no ability to stop.

Well, at least not twice. I've often wondered if a place like the one depicted in 'Terror Trap' were to exist, would I participate? I probably would give it a curious consideration, watch the sessions a couple of times, and then kill every motherfucker involved in the operation. But I'd save the videos for my own collection.

Terror Trap torture scene: [] 4453) Thomas Chaser. So here's one the piqued my interest. I'm normally not into Japanese stuff but this one is unique enough that I'm curious about it. Why just limit yourself to electrocuting one beautiful naked woman when you can electrocute two!

The Clip Scenes descriptions says its from 'Lady Attackers 3', but I didn't see that title listed in the reviews section here nor the Electro-Scenes Database. Can one of the Japanese experts here confirm that's the title, and possibly suggest a source for getting the video? Link to the clip: [] 4454) Bill K. Poll question for me is a repeat of the same question at Stakedamsels forum had but it was burning at the stake alone. Not other tortures or death methods. My answer is for capital punishment only if the powers that be bought back burning at the stake of convicted guilty as hell women is YES.

Men and women but to death always have witnesses to their execution. But I have a totally different view for real torture which only bad people do to other people. The torture gimp movies seen here do not torture women for real. The Rack Database scenes in movies do not show what really happens to a real gimp for no one would want to watch it. So a real life rack torture scene answer is NO. For the History of Pain movie rack scene YES. Actresses will live and completely recover so don't feel guilty.

It why I feel that guy that's always torturing and burning at the stake or cross Amy has the best job ever. The bottom line is I or we will never get to see public executions anyways, so we will never get the chance to find out if we really could watch a women tortured legally for real to death or the NOs really can say with 100% certainty they wouldn't watch it. Ralphus wrote: As a longtime collector of burning at the stake scenes, that was the ONLY time I've ever seen footage of the burned body after the scene. In my ongoing mission to keep our forum moderator (aka “the argument winner”) honest, I should point out that in the classic film Don't Go In The House, which has been discussed here many times, is shown for a few seconds post conflagration.

Yes, I know that as with the “ there's-no-rape-in-Cape-Fear” argument discussion, Ralphus will fall back on irrelevant criteria of his own invention to prove himself right “the scene was too short” “it was too dark” “there was no stake” etc. But we know otherwise, don't we sir. BTW, as DGITH includes this long wrist suspension scene (and at least one more if I recall), why is it not included in the rack database as a category “ S” film? * * * * * Poll: Haven't we done this one already?

It seems awfully familiar. Oh well easy for me to answer this time. I'm with A Canadian 100%. In short, any depiction of RL pain, peril or death, even when it's consensual, is a sexual turn-off for me.

That's why I've never been a fan of producers like Insex and Elite Pain, and it's why I don't frequent sites like BestGore and Ogrish. I confess to the usual rubber-necking fascination with this sort of thing, but I get no pleasure, let alone carnal thrills, from watching a woman publicly whipped or stoned in the Middle East or raped in a drunken stupor on some frat-boy's Facebook page. In fact, I find it repulsive and disheartening. So, if you haven't guessed, my answer is NO.

As for real life violence being more, well real – that's bullshit. We've all watched faked scenes in movies (even fetish clips) that are as real as anything you'd witness in the big, bad world, so those who insist on absolute authenticity already have access to credible surrogates. In fact, I prefer my GIMP entertainment not to be too believable – which is why I've been known to enjoy OTT scenes that would be impossible in real life. It helps ground the material as the fantasy it is intended to be.

And finally, a question for Ralphus (and those who would answer yes): do you actively seek out live torture and execution on the web? God knows, there seems to be enough of it around. If not, why not? If so, why is no one sharing it here? Why is it often banned on other GIMP fetish sites?

To me, the distinction is as clear as the one between our community and the ever-baffling bug-crush crowd. I understand some folks may enjoy their GIMP action live (and I am not about to judge them) but as with the BIMPers, I suspect there is limited overlap between our respective camps. 4456) Ralphus. Fritz wrote: In my ongoing mission to keep our forum moderator (aka “the argument winner”) honest, I should point out that in the classic film Don't Go In The House, which has been discussed here many times, the body is shown for a few seconds post conflagration.

Yes, I know that as with the “there's-no-rape-in-Cape-Fear” argument discussion, Ralphus will fall back on irrelevant criteria of his own invention to prove himself right “the scene was too short” “it was too dark” “there was no stake” etc. But we know otherwise, don't we sir. Fritz, you silly, silly cat. You think you can bring up the obvious answers that totally refute your point and then pretend you're stumping me by saying they're 'of my own invention'. Let me ask you, is there a burning at the stake scene in DGITH?

I'll answer it for you.NO! Yeah, there was a burning scene, but I said burning at the stake scene, didn't I?

Not the same thing, and you know it. Geez man, Nice Photoshop work, BTW BTW, as DGITH includes this long wrist suspension scene (and at least one more if I recall), why is it not included in the rack database as a category “S” film? You're confusing AOH with actual suspension. You do know the difference, right? The victim who went up in flames clearly had her feet planted on the floor the whole time. What can I say? You're wrong again.

And finally, a question for Ralphus (and those who would answer yes): do you actively seek out live torture and execution on the web? God knows, there seems to be enough of it around. If not, why not? If so, why is no one sharing it here? And where is all this live torture and execution supposed to be? You say there's a lot of it on the web; you must know something I don't. I have seen that BestGore site a few times and didn't stick around, but I can still understand the appeal.

When I used to work in video stores, the number one renters were the Faces of Death movies. In fact, it got to the point where the owners decided not to even carry them after a while because they were always getting stolen so they finally decided it wasn't worth it. But as to why is no one sharing it here? Because this site is about fantasy, not real life death scenes. And just to be clear, this poll question is also a hypothetical situation; no one is advocating torturing or killing someone in real life. It's simply asking if there were a live execution on TV, would you change the channel and tune in, or would you keep on watching 'Keeping Up With The Kardashians' or 'Honey Boo Boo' or whatever else you're watching. I can't believe I'm the only one so far who would admit to changing the channel.

But it's early still. The poll: no, no, no. My kink craves the intensity of conflict: willful minds and strong bodies clashing in a crucible of... Ugh, I need to stop before I start sounding like the PR shill for the Ultimate Fighting Octagon (r). You all get the gist. I fear that real interrogation-torture-peril involves precious little strength, will, or meaningful conflict; and what (little) I have read from the recent congressional report on post-9/11 CIA interrogation practices affirms this suspicion.

Even the hardest of hard cases will toss their mother under any possible bus to halt a dip on the waterboard. Because torture--at least as the CIA appears to practice it--is little more than inchoate violence to pass time. It doesn’t appear to have ever been planned, moderated, or equipped by anyone with any specific motive or experience, and it certainly doesn't seem to have ever “worked,” if your measure involves action-worthy intelligence or even just the simple, vengeful humiliation of a victim before an audience who’d care to see it. (Great, so a few flunkie temp-contractors shoved some things up Khaled Sheikh Mohammed’s ass once in a gardenshed somewhere on base in Gitmo. I’m sure the whole of Lower Manhattan feels completely vindicated to learn of this, ten years later.) Witnessing torture as the “professionals” appear to practice it in the modern world would be like watching some bored, lonely psychopathic kid spend an afternoon beating a stray cat.

Who among us (but the psychopath) could bear violence so completely stripped of volition or purpose? The fantasies we indulge here involve deep motive and rich (frankly, baroque) context; both the starring GIMPs and their antagonists are extraordinary characters in mind, body, spirit. They're extraordinarily strong, extraordinarily vicious, extraordinarily gorgeous. And their stories and circumstances are extraordinary to suit: they're princesses pulled on the grand inquisitor’s rack or spies in the clutches of Hitler's SS or superheroines run afoul of some grand Yakusa plot--they aren’t terrified, hopelessly disenfranchised souls branded “enemy combatants” by some suburban desk jockey’s pre-lunch-break type-o and abused for... Why, again (?)... By some random TSA temp-flunkie trainee. So the reports suggest that real torture scenes are hopelessly, crushingly banal; while our fantasies are anything but.

Who'd want to watch a bureaucratic temp abuse another ordinary (and probably, mistaken) person for no reason either can articulate? 4458) Covers.

Thomas Chaser wrote: The Clip Scenes descriptions says its from 'Lady Attackers 3', but I didn't see that title listed in the reviews section here nor the Electro-Scenes Database. Can one of the Japanese experts here confirm that's the title, and possibly suggest a source for getting the video? The actual title is Lady Attackers from Hell 3: Abduction and Torture, although the easiest way to find the film is to use its code, JBD-160. Here is the of the film that I posted last year. As You will see in the review, the movie can be purchased at Video Mayhem. It's also available at aaparadise.com and asianscreens.com. The previous film in the series, Lady Attackers from Hell 2, is by far the best of the bunch (both Ralphus and I picked it as the best movie of 2012).

Lady Attackers from Hell 3 isn't as strong but it still has its moments. 4460) J Scourge. I think a little clarification of my vote is in order after reading Bill K's opinion on the current poll question.

I am with him exactly! 'Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you?' I am quite pleased to see videos of real live girls being whipped and otherwise tormented when this is something that the actress has agreed to, as I understand it. If I thought this was truly something that was done against her will I would not be interested.

For those truly interested in reading more about real torture, the news is full of it now, not only with the senate report on the CIA but I also saw one yesterday about Brazil releasing a report on their own past with torture. 4461) Mad Max.

Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you? I would definitely NOT watch an actual torture session, nor a torture-like execution like burning at the stake; I can't say for sure about a more humane execution. Certainly it wouldn't be any sort of turn on, but that might be one of those things you just can't turn away from. The only way I'd want to be present at an actual torture scene is if I COULD stop it, and that's before any serious damage is done. 4462) Dr Yuya. Not a huge fan of real stuff.this is something I've learned about myself over time and not any attempt to prove I'm really noble on the inside. I honestly don't find it very much of a turn on.

Sure.sometimes the more 'real' productions from companies like Mood Pictures and Pain4Fem work for me.but I really think that even that is 9.999/10ths production and acting (the few films of theirs that get it right at least) and the rest actual suffering. Take my favorite director of anything ever.Kanzo Matsuura of Zen Pictures fame.

The guy, during what I call Zens 'golden age' consistently delivered legendary stuff that I feel still blows away anything else out there.from mainstream Hollywood scenes to BDSM films proper. And all of the tortures in his movies were completely and obviously 100% fake. Thing was it never mattered.because the actresses, the setup, the acting, scenarios and camera angles made the whole thing super hot. He proved to me that even if no actual torture was occuring.good camera tricks and reactions to make it appear so not only make that irrelevant but actually increase the overall sexy factor. In a way.it makes me feel pretty bad for actresses in Mood Pictures films or others who really 'take it'.

Seems like they're putting themselves through a lot of pain and trouble for even less return. 4463) fumetto. Poll question - even though I consider myself a hardcore Gimper there is no situation in which I would be a willing observer to that sort of reality - probably a result of a highly unsuccessful thirty year run in law enforcement and having been charged with cleaning up the results when the worst of us visit depredations on the rest - and many of those amounted to flat out 'executions' - no thanks, I'll stick to fantasy as the reality, even if justified, is simply too dreadful. Stay well all 4469) Tim.

I read the question and I would have to say that I would watch a public flogging and a public execution. I think it is about time to show people who commit murder what the ultimate penalty is. I say that if a man or woman is found guilty of murder with the help of DNA evidence, they should be taken out for immediate execution. There is no reason to give them a second trial or a stay of execution. It is time to start executing all those prisoners on death row and stop having tax payers pay to keep them alive.

4475) Bill K. Regards to Ralphus's post about burning at the stake or cross showing the gimp on fire, I ask Amy please in your next bats, show the stake damsel burning on fire which she did in Olalla, because visually in Maleficarum bats you never believe the flames were burning her. Her terrific acting was only indicator her body was being burnt. Stakedamsels movie scenes have never shown pubic hair on fire until Olalla. Ralphus, clarify is this true? There have been some short 5 to 10 second bats scene of clothed stake damsel's clothes on fire but not a nude one.

Fritz the grumpy cat is wrong. Mike B and Daniel: public flogging and public capital punishment are never going to happen in the USA. Televised or Web real public flogging, torture and execution is a remote possibility in some countries but not in the USA. The poll question is will you watch it if it were available on the web or TV.

Keep in mind 99% of the worst convicted and awaiting trial murderers are males. This is a Girls in Merciless Peril site so I agree with you the legal system sucks as it doesn't apply to the poll question. 4479) elkcreek. Well, after 24 hours, here's our first poll update: GIMP POLL: Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you? By my count, those who strictly said no have 11 votes.

Those who said yes to at least one aspect (say the flogging but not the execution) have 7 votes. It's a little closer than I expected, but what's really surprised me is the number of people who've stepped forward to cast votes. Pretty impressive so far.

Keep on going. ---------------------------------------- Responding to a few posts. JD wrote: Conservatism carry a heavy load of social/religious taboos, incompatible with true libertarianism. The opposition to abortion, the opposition to legalization of weed, whatever. How about the opposition to porn? That's a big one for Republicans, who have shown throughout history their eagerness to want to take away American's rights to view what they want in the privacy of their homes.

---------------------------------------- Bill K wrote: Stakedamsels movie scenes have never shown pubic hair on fire until Olalla. Ralphus, clarify is this true?

It's certainly the first time I ever saw it in a movie. My guess is that Amy and the Pachamama company were specifically catering to the BATS community this time around when they came up with the pussy burning idea. Perhaps a little something special to make up for the disappointing scene in Maleficarum. I haven't been over to the Stakedamsels forum in a month of Sundays.

I should check in to see how well the scene has been received over there. My guess is that they're probably losing their ever loving minds. Margot: That new trailer is 1000% better than the last one. Now THAT'S the way to sell a movie!

It has totally the opposite effect of the last one; this one would definitely make me want to see it now. You really ought to consider putting this version on YouTube. You'd get a lot more viewers that way. Yeah, I know it's got nudity, but frankly, any more a LOT of stuff I see on YouTube contains nudity, including movie previews.

They always have the option of deleting it, but that would only likely happen if someone were to complain. I sure wouldn't complain if I found this on YouTube! 4484) JD (the second). Ralphus: Hey that's a nice. I hope you don't mind if I appropriate it for my collection. As for the, that guy on the left doesn't look much like me, but since you asked me to do the mod, I guess I have only myself to blame.

Still, it's high time we upgraded those tech skills, buddy. It's just not right for me to help feed you your punch lines.

As to what I'm smoking, why of course, the choice of sophisticated felines everywhere. Now on to more important matters First off, I acknowledged in my post that there's no stake in the DGITH scene, so of course I was aware it didn't fit the BATS definition to a T, or rather an S. But as the salient point was about showing a burned GIMP body after the flames are extinguished, and this being among a very few films to do so, it certainly deserves mention here. Who cares if there wasn't a goddamned stake in the scene? Apparently people who are bats about BATS do. I'm not one of them, so this just seems like hair-splitting to me.

Besides, although you may indeed be a longtime BATS collector, I will split your hair further by noting you wrote “ that was the ONLY time I've ever seen footage of the burned body after the scene”, not a BATS scene. But when it comes to suspension, dear Ralphus, your predilection for technicalities leaves you hoisted by your own petard.

First off, though AOH is a pretty categorical term, “suspension” has many definitions and comes in a variety of flavors – a selection from which you pick and choose randomly to establish criteria for inclusion in the rack database. As its owner, that is your right, but how can you expect others to know what the criteria are if you don't define them, and when you yourself follow them inconsistently?

Examples In Ralphusworld, I presume a GIMP suspension scene involves a female victim being forcibly raised off the ground. Yet in the database, you include films like Julia X wherein the victim is left on tip-toe (as in DGITH) and is only “suspended” when she pulls her feet off the ground. Does it count if the victim suspends herself? Yet even if it does, the DB includes scenes from Daughters of Satan and The Mongols in which there is no off-the-ground suspension at all. Granted, you've identified them with a special AOH code – not defined of course, but self explanatory I suppose. But if these two films are allowed, why not others, especially classics like DGITH?

According to your own words, a category S scene depicts “suspension by wrists”. Again, you get to set the terms. But then you ignore your own criterion by including no less than three hung-by-the-hair scenes. Suddenly, you're not so, er, hung up on technicalities.

Yet on the other hand, you ignore non-wrist suspensions such as hanging by ankles (), jaw (), and breasts (). So with all these disparities and arbitrary choices, you can see why it's hard for cats without the secret decoder ring to know what's in and what's out. Probably because there is no secret decoder ring.

And as this all pertains to DGITH, I remember it was you ol' pal, who on 10/16/11 stated with such absolute conviction: But I'm going to reject the contention that the burning scene was not shot with a mannequin. I just pulled out my copy and looked at it again. There's absolutely no way that's a real person. And even after I posted an in which he clearly describes the scene was shot with a live actress and in-camera optical effects, you didn't back down. My hat's off to you, and I guess you get to keep your crown (or at least the bicorne).

Never surrender! The mark of a true master debater. Ralphus wrote: And where is all this live torture and execution supposed to be? You say there's a lot of it on the web; you must know something I don't.

You're kidding me, right? Just Google gore sites and wallow to your heart's content. I run across this stuff without even trying, and though the majority of it involves male victims, there seems to be a large contingent of women being tortured and killed as well, especially in videos from Mexico, Brazil, Africa and the Middle East. I also follow some of the foreign news channels on Youtube, many of which show far more than the sanitized content featured in NA.

I can still understand the appeal I would hope that “appeal” is morbid curiosity. I too can understand this, and it is why I'm occasionally drawn to material that revolts me. But that is worlds away from watching it to get the sort of sexual pleasure I enjoy from simulated GIMP scenes.

In the context of the poll, this distinction is critical – it's one thing to look at live brutality as a sensationalist diversion; quite another to use it as a masturbatory aid. But as to why is no one sharing it here? Because this site is about fantasy, not real life death scenes. But you just are begging the question of why this site is about fantasy rather than reality or both. When live material is posted on peril fantasy sites, it most always is shouted down and removed. Clearly it appeals to a different audience for different reasons. I maintain that a very small minority are sexually stimulated by real life violence, but a sizable group seeks it out because it provides a decidedly different type of frisson, one more akin to schadenfreude than kink.

If there were a live execution on TV, would you change the channel and tune in, or would you keep on watching 'Keeping Up With The Kardashians' or 'Honey Boo Boo' or whatever else you're watching. I don't watch television, so thank goodness I will never have to make this decision. Still, as per what I wrote above, I think for those who would change the channel, the more interesting question is. 4488) Ralphus. Fritz: Omigoodness, you'll try anything to make your point, won't you?

By deliberately quoting me out of context by using only half my sentence, you think you've got me, right? Here's what I originally wrote: As a longtime collector of burning at the stake scenes, that was the ONLY time I've ever seen footage of the burned body after the scene. Obviously, in the first half I am referring to burning at the stake scenes. You make it sound like when I say 'after the scene' that I'm referring to any kind of scene, when I specifically identified which type of scene I was writing about. If this were a court, the judge would have thrown out your argument already. At least you admit that you are indeed guilty of hair splitting.

Yes, hair splitting, not. Yet in the database, you include films like Julia X wherein the victim is left on tip-toe (as in DGITH) and is only “suspended” when she pulls her feet off the ground.

I don't think that's true. I just watched the clip again. The killer definitely hoists her up so that both feet are off the ground. She doesn't appear to be on tip-toe, but actually suspended here. She does a lot of tossing around and might barely be able to briefly touch the ground with her tiptoes, but only briefly. Either way, she's clearing hanging by her wrists. I feel justified including that scene here.

Yet even if it does, the DB includes scenes from Daughters of Satan and The Mongols in which there is no off-the-ground suspension at all. Granted, you've identified them with a special AOH code – not defined of course, but self explanatory I suppose. But if these two films are allowed, why not others, especially classics like DGITH? Well, both of those were not my entries, they were written, word for word, by Tony Wood, who wrote the original database. There actually is suspension in Daughters of Satan.the first lady is hanging suspended by one wrist. The second scene in the film is not suspension, and he duly marked that entry as 'S, AOH'. In my opinion, The Mongols really doesn't belong in the database, but it was Tony's list and he even justified it by stating he digs it so he's including it.

I kept that entry as a nod to Tony. It wouldn't really feel right to remove his personal selections since it was his list to begin with. According to your own words, a category S scene depicts “suspension by wrists”.

Again, you get to set the terms. But then you ignore your own criterion by including no less than three hung-by-the-hair scenes. Hey, if Tony can put in his own exceptions, so can I. I'm in charge of the list now. Personally I think that hanging from the hair would have to be a lot more painful than by the wrists. Yet on the other hand, you ignore non-wrist suspensions such as hanging by ankles (Gestapo's Last Orgy), jaw (El valle de los miserables), and breasts (Cannibal Ferox). I thought about upside-down suspensions, since I seriously dig them.

Ultimately I decided against them. I think the reason why Tony made his list include both racks and suspension is because of the stretching aspect you get when she is hanging by her wrists is similar to being on a rack. I don't think the same type of stretching would apply to upside-down scenes, which is why he never included them. I've never seen the jaw hanging movie. The tit-hanging scene in Cannibal Ferox is a great scene, but I never really considered it for inclusion in the database. I'm trying to stay faithful to the original intention of Tony's list. But you make a point in that there's a bit of grey area there where some exceptions could be made.

My exceptions were the hair hanging ones. So sue me 4489) Covers. Hi, all, I have been wondering whether stepping in to vote the new poll. Reluctant, not so as to what to vote, but as to the explanation of the vote (that cheesy UN language). My vote goes for a 'No'. 'Real violence against women' is not my thing, and it is not the thing of this forum, according to the disclaimer on top of it. Much less 'unfair violence', in the terms I explained in the last poll (contrary to Fritz, I do find a connection between them both).

I have been following with interest (and a bit of astonishment) the discussion about the 'History of Torture' latest production. What amazes me is the importance given to the fact that at least 'some' of the torture depicted were 'real punishments inflicted to the actresses', and the fact that many watchers regarded that a definite plus. Even at the expense of realism or 'historical accuracy' (lashes as part of an inquisitorial proceeding?) that overshadows the rather clumsy arguing about the accuracy of the model of rack used -of which there is no surviving evidence, the closest model apparently being the one in a film - ('Akelarre'). The same vein (prioritizing 'live/real punishment' over any other consideration) looks to be present in the earlier release, the so-called 'Military interrogation' (again: lashes in a modern interrogation? WTF?) Lashes being the 'real punishment' which results easier to inflict on a condensing person (second only to hot wax) it looks like the production is deliberately aiming for that -and of course hinting at the approval of the BDSM community, as in the case of the candle wax, seen in a quantity of productions purportedly claiming to reproduce 'medieval' themes. All in all, the 'HoT' productions (I've been watching I think three of them) are incredibly fake and cheesy looking. That said, I would step into my role as intelligence officer any time.

El Wananchi 4492) Osouk. The poll is an easy choice for me - emphatically NO. I have absolutely no interest in seeing real torture. It doesn't hold any erotic appeal for me. The likes of Elite Pain and Insex are OK, even though they feature real rather than simulated pain, as they are consensual - the girls are voluntarily there. I do have a slight grey area around written reports of real torture.

In my formative years I would seek out Amnesty International reports and avidly read the accounts of torture in South America. I think this is probably where I got my love of interrogation from. I can't help feeling a bit guilty as these are real women who have been tortured, but if I was offered a video of the torture I would not want to see it at all. I also think real torture would not fit with my idealised view of what it should be like. I'm quite fussy about the things I find interesting, and I can't help feeling the real thing would not tick the necessary boxes anyway. Ralphus - I've been trying to contact you - your normal email still doesn't work for me, so I sent one to the other email you gave me but I haven't had a reply - can you contact me at my email above?

'Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch a live torture session, such as a public flogging, or even a live execution, like a hanging or a burning at the stake, or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you?' A real execution? The very idea is abhorrent. GIMP scenes are, to me, more akin to the thrill one gets from watching a horror movie. Suspense and anticipation are far more interesting than the bloody murder that follows. Even in my favorite movie moments, I much prefer it when the victim is ultimately rescued.following several hours of gratuitous nudity and creatively sexualized torture, of course. But, watching a real live hanging (or what have you) just feels wrong and not at all sexy.

Even if this was still the Dark Ages, and people were having their heads chopped off every other day, the reality would probably resemble something like this: [] I offer this as an alternative: What if, instead of an overt torture/death sentence; a beautiful young criminal was sentenced to some form of public humiliation? Call me weird (or, actually pretty tame), but I've always been partial to things like stocks/pillories and branks/scold's bridles.

I'm not advocating their use on anyone, but I find them far more appealing than executions. The idea of seeing a victim bound and helpless excites me more than watching them being maimed or killed. I know I'm not speaking for everybody, that's just how I feel about it.

4494) Boccaccio. My vote on the poll question would be a definite 'no.' That said, I have seen some BDSM videos where both the woman's performance and the punishment meted out were so convincing that there was some doubt, at least in my mind, as to whether her participation was fully consensual. And frankly it troubles me a little bit that (provided that the 'actress' is really attractive) I find such intensity and that realism both compelling and exciting. Guilty pleasures. _____________ Delighted by Poppy’s agonized reaction, Song grinned evilly, and then, after receiving a slow nod of consent from General Wang, placed the other sharp splint just below the tip of Poppy’s left breast. As the general looked on approvingly, Song slowly, slowly, slowly forced the razor-sharp splint upward and inward into the base of her nipple until it all but disappeared.

As Poppy’s young body spasmed violently. The pain caused by the bamboo needles caused the bit-gagged beauty to spew new rivulets of saliva down onto her jutting breasts. “And now, my sweet, we shall finish the other one,” Song whispered. “No please no.” 4495) Video Mayhem. Finally, I have the pleasure to announce that the 'Sadism in the Movies' Picture Gallery is now open. Everyone is welcome to browse, but this should prove especially useful to owners of this book since they will find most of the pictures now identified. However, there are still 54 pictures that I have been unable to identify with certainty and so any help with them will be much appreciated.

The link is: [] I would like to thank Covers very much for graciously hosting this gallery. 4499) A Canadian. Ralphus: Based on your last reply, and despite the pic of that poor bifurcated bunny, you've got a bit to learn about hare splitting I mean hair splitting. It's why I split your sentence, separating the implicit – as a longtime collector of antimacassars – from the explicit – the scene. And yes, I was pulling your leg.

That Julia X picture actually proves my point more than yours. Look at this. The woman's right foot is on the ground, and her left leg is slightly raised and bent forward. Also note that the top of her left boot is a few inches higher than the right. But the debate is moot anyway, as you've acknowledged the other feet-on-the-ground suspensions I mentioned are legit.

Personally, I don't care if it was Tony who made the exceptions, or you, or Casper the Friendly Ghost. Nor do I care why or when they were made. If your reason to include hair suspensions was that they are “painful” (what was I saying about arbitrary criteria?), that is indeed your prerogative, because as you say “”. Just don't go accusing others of making wrong suggestions when you yourself make all sorts of exceptions and rejections based on undocumented whims.

If it were up to me, I'd limit the rack database to, well, rack scenes, and list all the suspensions separately. But that's just me, the underpaid minion who's always wrong.

BTW I'm still waiting for you to tell Joseph Ellison and me how we are wrong about his not using a mannequin in the DGITH burning scene. 4504) JD (the second). Fritz: 3 quick points or I'll be late for work. 1) Based on your close-up 'evidence' of the Julia X scene, I'd say the results are inconclusive. Therefore, we the jury hold for the defense.

2) I wonder how many people get your Alexander Haig joke? You're really showing your age there, buddy!

3) I tend to agree with you regarding making the Rack Database and a Suspension Database separate entities. It would give us more flexibility and allow for a greater variety of scenes.

Perhaps a project for the future. Like I really need more ---------------------------------------------- The Covert Affairs electro scene: Damn, what a great jolt to the adrenaline to get the morning started! I can't wipe this smile off my face! 4507) Covers. Olalla has reviews! Olalla is generating a lot of talk in many places.

There are comments here and elsewhere, there are great reviews, and the film has been out in the world for only a few days, and on a limited release! There is going to be a private screening for 40 guests in NYC tonight (Saturday December 13th!). And that is just the beginning. We're just starting to promote it, the theatrical release is a couple of months away. It's set for the 29th of January, and the impression from people that had the pleasure of watching this wonderful film, is that this is a really good movie.

But, don't let me say that, let's hear it from the viewers: Dean Andersson has a and he has a lot to say, I'll quote some parts that I believe will have an impact here. You can read the: Amy Hesketh’s OLALLA would have become a favorite film of mine even without the Vampires.

(.) Olalla is a Vampire like no other, and OLALLA is a Vampire film like no other. (.) Olalla is portrayed with a sly undercurrent of self-deceptive innocence by Hesketh herself. She yearns to be an ordinary woman and go shopping, but she does not have “ordinary” in, umm, well, in her blood. S(.) not even after the repeated encouragements of a skillfully applied riding crop, wielded by the family’s dedicated enforcer, Felipe, played with exquisite intensity by Jac Avila (hard-ass to the max, but with Olalla’s best interests seething in his Vampire-heart). Tough love, thy name is Felipe (.) I was pulling for mom and could hardly stand to watch her ending. Yes, Hesketh, both as actor and director, is so good that she did a number on jaded horror movie watcher me. Not that I'm complaining, but no one deserves to die that way (though thousands, maybe millions have, over the centuries), especially not a good-hearted mother, Vampire or not!

It's those damned villagers with their pointed sticks! Superstitious fools! And how dare the leader, played with suitably manic enthusiasm by Eric Calancha, whip her so much?

Sure, his fear makes him merciless, but over and over his whip marks her flesh; until, hey! That's enough! Well, maybe just one morebut no one looks away! No one averts their eyes, not even me, from her pain and her shame as the flames rise higher and her screams grow more frantic. And the heartbreaking, heroic way she tries to endure it and accept it then gives up and starts desperately wrenching on her ropes.

Won't anyone show her some mercy? Won't someone cut her loose in time?

They're coming from her now! It’s too late!

(.) Mila Joya plays Ofelia as a playfully seductive predator, with a subtle undercurrent that made me wonder just how many throats she herself had ripped out, in secret, without telling anyone, and never getting caught. (.) I have been waiting for OLALLA most of my life. But thanks to Amy Hesketh, its award-winning writer, director, star, and to Jac Avila and all the rest at Pachamama Films, none of us have to wait any longer. Three cheers and all the first magnitude stars in a star atlas for OLALLA! Just don't watch NOSFERATU with her, okay? But if you do, at least do not talk through the film in an attempt to impress her with how well-versed you are in NOSFERATU film-lore.

It's not a good idea. You'll be sorry; heh heh heh.Hesketh! That is a review that looks at the film in its entirety, it compares it, or lists it with other films of the genre, it even mentions Jac Avila's Macabre Masterpiece Dead But Dreaming!

It is the kind of review that propels the film with mainstream audiences. Which is very, very good. Amy was recently interviewed by Fangoria, that famous magazine is making a feature story on Olalla. This is all very good. Olalla is a great gothic film while keeping our fans happy with a lot of GIMP.

We have gimpy comments and reviews as well. I saw the Olalla bats scene and I've got to say Amy is hot and this woman is on fire. Literally she on fire this time which means the bush fire alert symbol has been posted. The acting in the bats scene was fantastic from Amy and this time lots of firewood and flames compared to the Maleficarum bats which I never got the visual look that Amy was actually on fire burning.

The whipping and tenderizing of Amy before the fire was set was a good call too. Overall the bats scene made the movie. As for the bed bound raping scene was well, that was it for the gimp scenes in the entire movie.

I have to admit that we were somewhat disappointed with the reaction in this forum to the BATS scene in Maleficarum. We worked an entire day, from very early morning to late afternoon on that scene. With the hot sun on top of us and the wind making things difficult. We can't control the weather. We didn't have a lot of experience burning someone at the stake, so Jac used all of the powers of his imaginations to pull out the scene. The bright sun did a number on the film.

It was hard to see the beautiful flames with that sun overpowering the light and glow of said flames. That's one reason why is not as impressive as it should be. For the second BATS film Jac decided to have the scene at night, the flames would look amazing against the dark of night and that's how it was. But if you pay attention to Maleficarum, you can see the flames all around Amy. Which was difficult to do. What you see in the following picture is not CGI, no fake flames, but actual flames burning the wood in the picture.

Not a lot of wood, granted, but look at the surroundings, not a lot of trees there, mostly bushes. And if you see closely, that foot there is turning ugly dark. I can only rate the movie Bats scene an 'A' and for the other parts of movie, I've got to say I was spoiled by Maleficarum's non stop whipping, roasting and torturing scenes so I expected see some of the same type gimp scenes in Olalla than there was. Couldn't Amy slowly eat a couple women too between the couple of clueless guys she ate at least?

For the lack of gimp scenes I can't give the rest of the movie a rating at all. Still Amy, keep that bats look in your next bats movie but think clothed bats next time and much more pre whipping and torture scenes also. Thank you very much big grin for the Olalla bats movie. I don't know when will we have a BATS scene in a movie, perhaps another Maleficarum story.

Which is already written. It's aptly titled Maleficarum II - Monxa Mala. The story is awesome, but it requires a sizeable budget. Our next story with a lot, a whole lot of GIMP, Maleficarum style, non ending whippings, rack scenes, crucifixions and a lot more is the one we're preparing. We can only make more movies if we sell them.

So, we're hoping that Olalla will do well so we can go on with the next production soon! Mr bush post question ' does the bush fire alert mean her bush (pubic hair) gets burned?' Yes, Amy's pubic bush does catch fire and burns perhaps longer then logically it should. But I'm not complaining. Interesting observation about Amy's pubics catching some fire. Well, there's a reason for it.

The day we were shooting the movie the winds were very, very strong, pushing the flames this way, that way, ferociously, so they were just liking Olalla's body at times. So, at one point, as the flames passed by Olalla's body they set her pubics on fire and immediately after that a piece of the rope hanging from her wrist. So, after that it was a matter of time before the ropes on her wrists, and later her hair would catch on fire.

We must also remember that the pubic hair works like straw works on wood. It catches fire fast, but the fire doesn't go away if it has something else to burn, like wood.

Or flesh, that's why the fire on the bush stays burning, like the ropes, and the hair. Regards to Ralphus's post about burning at the stake or cross showing the gimp on fire, I ask Amy please in your next bats, show the stake damsel burning on fire which she did in Olalla, because visually in Maleficarum bats you never believe the flames were burning her.

Her terrific acting was only indicator her body was being burnt. Stakedamsels movie scenes have never shown pubic hair on fire until Olalla.

Ralphus, clarify is this true? There have been some short 5 to 10 second bats scene of clothed stake damsel's clothes on fire but not a nude one. Again, you can see the slow fire in Maleficarum burn Amy. I mentioned before that the Inquisitor's torture of choice for Mariana's demise was the every slow ' Fuego Lento', (slow burning fire) which is, still, popular in these Andean parts where it's not only difficult to get good wood, and lots of it, but where there's not enough oxygen, making it difficult to burn anything.

Did you know that a 3 minute soft boiled egg takes 12 min in La Paz? That's what I'm taking about. The Andes are not famous for their wood supply, that's why houses are made out of Adobes. Mud Bricks, and they don't have any wood in them, I'm talking about the old houses. There's straw, lots of dry straw, but that burns in a second.

Santorum Just had to stop in after watching Olalla. Another fine film, though no doubt too odd and arty-fartsy for some. And I have to say that from a GIMP perspective, I was totally surprised by something.

Like everyone else awaiting the film, I knew there was a big BATS scene coming at the end. But I had no idea that it would be preceded by a fairly long and intense public flogging scene.

A scene that damn near rivals the one in Dead But Dreaming. Seriously folks, if public floggings excite you and you were thinking you'd pass on Olalla because you're not into BATS scenes, you're making a big mistake. Amy's reactions during this scene are the best expressions of agony she's ever given us. If her screams in previous efforts have left you less than 100% convinced, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised here. It's really quite an amazing (and utterly believable) performance. During the shooting of the long, very long whipping scene, there were some interesting things happening.

The extras had no idea what they were going to witness. They were told there would be whipping and nudity, but they expected the lame kind, where maybe a breast is shown briefly, maybe for two seconds of screen time, maybe, and the whipping. And then they saw, they saw how Eric and Gina, who was a witness in Maleficarum, stripped Amy totally naked and then Eric proceeded to whip her harshly, non stop, with Miguel capturing everything with his camera. And this went on all afternoon, before the extras were sent to gather the wood for the burning. I have to say that the extras were impressed and I believe they still talk about it. Jac was the one in charge of directing the extras to scream and throw things at Amy, and they were doing a great job, Amy was truly scared of them. She said that 'I really felt they wanted to kill me'.

Ralphus So I got my first look at Olalla tonight. I have to admit I was excited when they announced plans for it last year, but after seeing the trailer, I scaled back my enthusiasm a bit. Yeah, I know it had to be YouTube friendly, but there's none of the promised GIMP-worthy scenes in it, so all they were left with was a weird, confusing preview that doesn't exactly scream 'Buy me'.

The fact we had a zero comments on it here on the board, despite it being posted 3 times, says volumes. That first trailer was made before the color correction and sound mix was ready. So, Jac was simply cautious. He didn't want the trailer to represent the film.

But we needed a bit of a trailer to get the ball rolling, there was a planned avant-premiere those days and we needed a trailer. The Avant-Premiere didn't happen. Soon after, Jac got the film with all its glorious colors and sound mix and went on to make the thrilling trailer. Ralphus But here's the real truth. Forget the lousy trailer.

The movie itself delivers the goods. Oh, it's still weird and a bit confusing in spots. Amy plays two characters, a modern-day woman and (I think) her own mother, although the latter character's scenes take place too far in the past for that to be the case. The good news is both Amys get tied up. There's actually a LOT of GIMPage in this one, all of it totally naked. And Amy looks great tied up without any clothes on.

She's tied to the bed and whipped with a riding crop twice, and also raped. And the much vaulted conclusion features her tied to a cross, whipped and burned at the stake. Amy plays Olalla, and her mother, also named Olalla.

They are both vamps, but not your traditionally, big fangs, eternal and undead vamps, no, these are not dead vamps, they are alive, they don't have fangs, but they do live long, but age very slowly, and they need blood to keep on living. And they have to be incestuous to keep their line going. So, they are decadent vampires with human frailties, so if you tied them and whip them and burn them, they do suffer and die and they don't come back. When they die, they die, like the rest of us mortals.

Ralphus BATS lovers will be mostly happy with the way the BATS was shot this time. Still not the huge burning pyre I was hoping for, but they pulled it off better here than they did in Maleficarum. Plot-wise, the movie is about a family of.get ready for it.vampires. Oh God, not vampires again! Not my favorite genre, but I guess vampires are hot these days. And if it brings in the audiences on that aspect alone, more power to them. It's not as bizarre and disjointed as Dead But Dreaming, their last vampire opus.

There's some blood but not a huge amount. This one's really more of a dark comedy. My guess is that the GIMP crowd will buy it for the bondage scenes but be pleasantly surprised by the story. I would recommend this one.

Yes, the story has its dark humor and it is inspired in the story Robert Louis Stevenson wrote and didn't actually finish. It is about a family who have vampirism in their genes and are on their way out. The original story is set in Spain in the late 1800's. Amy takes the story and gives it a fantastic spin where hot sex, torture, incest, love, hate, pain, live together within a weird family that many in these parts compare it to the Adams Family. Ralphus Margot: That new trailer is 1000% better than the last one. Now THAT'S the way to sell a movie!

It has totally the opposite effect of the last one; this one would definitely make me want to see it now. You really ought to consider putting this version on YouTube. You'd get a lot more viewers that way.

Yeah, I know it's got nudity, but frankly, any more a LOT of stuff I see on YouTube contains nudity, including movie previews. They always have the option of deleting it, but that would only likely happen if someone were to complain. I sure wouldn't complain if I found this on YouTube! 2005 Chevy Silverado Driver Door Module. Amy is the one that decides what goes on YouTube, so it is up to her to put it up there. She might if convinced by some sane argument that the YouTube censor patrol won't come to bite her ass. The trailer itself had to show GIMP, and a good story as well, and it had to give an idea of the many characters that populate the screen.

It's a success. Yes, I agree we would have a larger audience for it in YouTube, so, we'll see. And here it is again, for your viewing pleasure. Ralphus Bill K wrote: Stakedamsels movie scenes have never shown pubic hair on fire until Olalla. Ralphus, clarify is this true? It's certainly the first time I ever saw it in a movie.

My guess is that Amy and the Pachamama company were specifically catering to the BATS community this time around when they came up with the pussy burning idea. Perhaps a little something special to make up for the disappointing scene in Maleficarum.

I haven't been over to the Stakedamsels forum in a month of Sundays. I should check in to see how well the scene has been received over there. My guess is that they're probably losing their ever loving minds. JD also wrote: Well, the prosaic historic reality shows that the female victims were almost always old hags, full of warts and missing teeth.

How about if they all looked like Amy Hesketh? I'd gladly watch her burn (again). If I had my way, you'd be ashes big grin I already discussed the burning bush situation.

Yes, Amy and Jac were trying to get a better BATS scene in this one, that is a fact that cannot be denied, the issues that made the BATS scene in Maleficarum a bit disappointing, had to be overcome, and that required money. So, the IndieGoGo campaign was launched and the funds became available to be able to go to the location and be there for a whole week, with one full day and night for the scene, which was planned in detail. Something that makes Jac very proud of his production abilities. So, Jac and Amy are planning to use that extra experience into the next production, Justine, which soon will be the subject of countless posts with lots of pictures. Now we must concentrate in Olalla, which has to do very well for us to grow in our production values and possibilities.

Ralphus said 'My guess is that they're probably losing their ever loving minds.' Just the opposite Ralphus, like Maleficarum there's not much interest in Olalla at the SD forum.

It may be due to the fact that Olalla just got released. At least I hope so.

Amy will be contacting the SD forum, with pictures and all of that. For some reason I lost my access, I have no idea why. I can't post, period.

But she can and she will. But she's now very busy with her travels through the US so I guess she'll do it when she settles in Maine for the holidays and with a bit more time and internet access in her hands.

We're expecting a very busy year in 2015, so. I think we're going to relax a bit these days.

We deserve it. Although the work is never done completely. We'll continue, but at a slower pace. I leave you with So, that's that for today. It's not long, is it? 4511) Bill K.

Terrific post, Reine Margot. I thought the whole Olalla movie was good entertainment from an erotic viewpoint besides the Amy Bats scene. I'm just a Bats fiery peril nut and rating other parts of the Olalla movie was not what pushed my erotic button.

I didn't want Amy or Margot to think it wasn't good when I said I can't rate the other part of the movie. The heat of the flames would have logically ignited Amy's pussy hair first and then shortly after her head hair. Then the body would catch fire somewhat after that, which the Olalla Amy's bats more or less did then.

The only thing which is not important was Amy could have been gasping and choking for air at the last moments of life because her lungs would be filling with hot gases due to the big hot fire. She would then choke to death before she burnt to death. No problem for overall it's a fantastic bats scene. In the Maleficarum Bats scene, Amy with the much smaller hotter fire would have slowly burnt to death if the dummies ( sorry Amy ) hadn't left so she was stinking rescued and didn't choke to death like in Olalla. You know, Amy, Jac and Margot, that ugh rescue can be fixed in the Maleficarum bats revisited (hint ) with the Olalla bats editing. Wouldn't need a Maleficarum II. Food for thought, and that's not a vampire reference.

Ralphus has kindly added a story I wrote a few years ago. It has a connection with the latest polls - it features both a gag and an interrogation. It was inspired by a newspaper article I read way back in the 70s - I think it could have been the first time I'd read anything about torture that featured women's genitals. It made a big impression on me, and I can still quote the article word for word, even though I can barely remember anything else from around that time! The direct link is in the website address in this post. I hope you enjoy it. The current poll raises some interesting and difficult questions.

My instinctive answer, like the majority, would be: “no, I never would accept to witness such things in reality”. But But then I start to wonder. Why do I enjoy brief scenes from mainstream movies more than explicit, hour-long scenes from some specialized producer? Why are the best whipping scenes I remember right away, let’s say “Isabella duchessa dei diavoli” of the sixties, “Requiem for Granada” of the eighties and “Hispania – the legend” of just a few years ago so much better than anything done by Mood, Kink or other producers? Isn't it because, through better acting, skilled editing and filming, they somehow appear more real than the “truly real” products appear to be? I have no doubt that the actresses in some of the movies shown here suffer for real and have to take long breaks between scenes, but still you can see the blows, albeit real, are not pulled at full force, and the overall effect is rather UNrealistic.

Or why do I prefer, vastly prefer, the works of Quoom or Arcas above BDSM shots of real models? Isn't it because in their virtual worlds the scenes are somehow more “real” than reality?

So when I, when we, fantasize about “girls in merciless peril”, when we say “it’s OK in fantasy, never in reality” what is the exact nature of those fantasies? Let me be clear: I have no doubt that the ratio of abusive men is a lot lower among those who enjoy a site such as this than among those who would see it forcibly shut down. I have no doubt we all, more or less, are respectable, decent people. But again, what is the nature of our fantasies? To clarify: suppose you're middle aged or right out old, and you daydream of being twenty once again.

If by some scientifical, magical or metaphysical mean you could turn that dream in reality, would you pull back? Of course you wouldn't. If you are a mediocrily gifted amateur at something, let’s say writing or sports, dreaming of winning the Noble prize or Wimbledon, would you turn your back on the opportunity of getting the skills of a Goethe or a Federer? Of course you wouldn't. If you buy a lottery ticket and you win, say, a billion dollars, would you dump the winning ticket because plenty other people in history had their lives screwed up because they won too much money? I dare say you would not.

So what exactly is a fantasy that you enjoy but you do NOT want to become reality? Does that even make sense?

Is it a conflict inside our psyches? Is it nature versus nurture? Are all humans inherently violent and is it just a matter of degrees, of stronger inhibitions that separates us from the Torquemadas or the Bathory’s? So would you, would I, really not take a peek, at least out of curiosity? Of course soon we would feel bad, guilty, even sick, but still. I really don't know.

For sure, I can think of some interesting variations on the poll question. Some have already been made.

Would it make a difference I you were raised in a time and place were such spectacles were commonly accepted and seen as rightful (of course it would)? Would it make a difference if the victim is male or female, young or old, pretty or homely, guilty or innocent? Of course it’s a big difference between an execution and a punishment, but what about the specifics? A quartering is disturbing to me even when rendered through poser, by the way. But punishments? Would electric shocks be more bearable to watch than a flogging due to no blood being involved? Would you watch public punishment through tickling?

And what about punishments with no element of physical pain at all? Enforced public nudity is certainly a form of torture, but if you were in a country, in a time or place where such forms of punishment were common, would you really not take a look at a beautiful woman forced to expose herself as a form of punishment? And would it matter if the victim was somehow known to you?

Would you be more interested in the punishment of some movie star or socialite? Or would you be willing to see how the girl that cheated on you and crushed your heart, or the ruthless female boss who ruined your career, gets some well-deserved (?) lashes? Finally, always trying to clarify the exact nature of those fantasies, what would you say if through some futuristic technology one could watch scenes happened in the past as if they were recorded in HD? This time not only do you have no means to stop it, as in the original poll question, it actually already happened. No one is going to suffer more or less because you see it. Would you still say no, not interested, or would you watch, say, Jean d’Arc burn at the stake?

Anne Askew on the rack? Would you start surfing imperial Rome web-style in the hope of stumbling upon the punishment and maybe crucifixion of some long-dead (but in the recording still young and pretty) slave girl? And what if, through some futuristic drug or technology like in “Total Recall” you could pick a dream to live in for a week or two, during which dream you would experience everything as real? This time no one gets hurt, not even in the past, but you would realize that only before and after the experience. Would you say no, or would you chose to be a medieval inquisitor, a Roman centurion, a Gestapo interrogator for some time, maybe even placing your significant other in the role of the victim? LL, Thank you for stimulating more thought-provoking points on this. I don't often post here, but this latest Opinion Poll is fascinating to me.

I feel it's a rare and candid look into a function of the Human Condition that many refuse to acknowledge. I have often felt that society chooses to allow itself certain indulgences, while simultaneously demonizing other behaviors as a means of justifying its own cultural ethos.

The question as it stands is: “Assuming you had no power to stop it, would you personally watch [ _________ ].” “. Or would the fact that it's real and not merely fantasy deter you?” The underlying question behind this may be: “ If you could actualize a fantasy, no matter how repugnant, would you?” Though intriguing, as we cannot (yet) utilize a time machine, the concept of objectively viewing a historical execution is something of a moot point. Instead, I posit the following as a contemporary substitute. [Note: I intend no disrespect to any creed or culture with any of the following.] In the past, vast multitudes gathered to be entertained by blood sports in the gladiatorial arenas of Ancient Rome. Armed gladiators fought to the death or slaughtered wild beasts for the enjoyment of spectators. Ruins and historical records are testament to this, and we know that it was no mere “guilty pleasure” so much as a socially accepted institution of the day.

Movie moments not withstanding; enjoying such a spectacle means that at least a portion of the audience actively condoned it, and were taking part in the events, albeit passively. Otherwise, they could have chosen to be anywhere else but in that arena. While modern man cannot visit Ancient Rome, a lingering aspect yet remains with the continued tradition of Bull Fighting. Most people living in Europe or the Americas are a few hours drive and an admission ticket away from permission to watch a living creature's slow and methodical death. Now, thanks to the advent of modern technologies (YouTube), at this very moment, anyone reading this can easily view the televised recordings of a Bull Fight. Whether you agree with it or not, it's there for your delectation, should you choose to do so. Whatever your opinion on the subject, you can choose to see the moments where a Matador performs his art expertly, or you may choose to view the “accidents” where a human being is visibly gored with very real and life-threatening injuries.

There are even videos of child matadors injured in the ring. None of the violence is staged, and it goes on every day in certain countries despite heated protest. [Here's the obligatory GIMP moment for anyone reading this.] Presented with this reality, and knowing that there's no real consequence for doing so, do we choose to partake in the enjoyment of these events, all from the comfort of our own computers? Or, is the reality that something suffered and died, and the disgust that entails, enough to stop us?

Food for thought. In the Twilight Zone. T, thanks for replying. I too usually don't post (time constraints) but this was just too interesting a topic. Two quick counters: 1) you call it 'moot point', in philosophy jargon we prefer to call it 'thought experiment'. In the end it's more or less the same but it sounds so much better 2) I think re corridas et similia people either despise it as all other forms off cruelty on animals, or approve it.

I find it hard to imagine anybody enjoying fantasies of inflicting pain on animals, of 'animals in merciless peril', and then the same weirdo passing by the opportunity to see it for real. Of course, while such people may seem incomprehensible perverts to me, probably all of us 'gimpers' appear the same way to the outside world. 4516) A Canadian.

Title: Commander Iron Lady - Humiliating Gang Rape Assault (HBAD-263) Starring: Emiri Okazaki and Rei Mizuna Produced by: Hibino Running time: Two hours Commander Iron Lady - Humiliating Gang Rape Assault is an uninspired wartime tale from the Japanese porn company, Hibino, that gets a huge lift from its beautiful star, Emiri Okazaki. Emiri, who looks a bit like JAV superstar Rio, is smoking hot. Her initial rape scene is the only thing worth recommending in this movie -- but it is definitely recommended. Unfortunately for Emiri, she reports to a perverted senior commander with a mean streak of his own. The senior commander takes cadet Rei to a separate room and makes the young cadet blow him. When he returns to the room where Emiri and her men are questioning a prisoner, the senior commander turns the tables on Emiri.

The senior commander tells two soldiers to grab Emiri by the arms. Two other soldier brings in young Rei, who is now a prisoner and whose head is wrapped in a gauze bandage. Threatening further harm to Rei, the senior commander makes Emiri submit to his carnal desires. Repulsed, Emiri spits in the senior commander's face, but the senior commander isn't dissuaded. With Emiri still in a standing position, the senior commander forces more kisses on her and sucks her tits. He also removes Emiri's skirt and yanks down her panties so he can squeeze her ass and finger her pussy. The senior commander orders his soldiers to put Emiri on a covered table on her back.

As the soldiers pin Emiri on the table and hold her arms and legs apart, the senior commander fingers Emiri, dines on her pussy and tongues her butt hole. Moving to the other side of the table, the senior commander forces Emiri to blow him.

The senior commander goes back to Emiri's spread legs and rubs his dick against her pussy. Emiri protests but her complaints have no effect. The senior commander plunders Emiri while Emiri remains pinned on her back. As to the poll, some interesting answers and and interesting look at the inner conflicts between id and super ego. I am honest enough to say that, reality vs.

Fantasy in most cases depends on the conditions we find ourselves in. Most of us have these fantasies, but we do not have the conditions to make them into reality. If any of us were rich, powerful, bored, above the law, knew we could have and do what we want, would we make my fantasies reality? If, say being an every day guy with limited resources and opportunity, needing to conform to the social mores of society, but then you found yourself in a situation where the mores broke down, like in war, what would you do? Think about it a while before responding. 4522) Charles.

Catching up on the latest activity. LL: Fantastic post; you brought up many scenarios that should give plenty of posters some proverbial food for thought. It's really easy just to put your hands over your ears and chant 'No, no, no!' Like some have already done here, and maybe some really would continuously say no after each instance, but the questions aren't always so cut and dried. Particularly the one about the girl who crushed your heart.watching her publicly punished would be sweet to watch.

Not like I have anyone specific in mind or anything. ------------------------------------------- T wrote: I don't often post here, but this latest Opinion Poll is fascinating to me. I feel it's a rare and candid look into a function of the Human Condition that many refuse to acknowledge. I have often felt that society chooses to allow itself certain indulgences, while simultaneously demonizing other behaviors as a means of justifying its own cultural ethos.

Another great post, thank you. I think it's a fascinating question, too. I'm always interested in the psychology behind the fetish.what makes us tick, and where do we draw the line between fantasy and reality? I think in this supposedly 'more enlightened' era of the 21st Century, we've become programmed to excuse our perversions, even on a forum that discusses topics as socially deviant as this one, by saying we enjoy the fantasy but would never, ever condone watching the act for real.

But I like the Time Machine aspect, where if we were to go back in time and be in the audience at one of Torquemada's dungeons, would we, indeed, watch with a certain amount of interest and dare I say, pleasure? It's a question that could never be answered for certain, since the instances would always be hypothetical, but it does give one pause before answering.

BTW, I liked the anti-bullfighting video, comparing it with the stoning of a bound woman. For the record, I've always found the concept of bullfighting abhorrent, and rodeos, too.

But they seem to draw in the crowds. It's kind of depressing, but the same people that frequent events like that might say the same thing about our interests, too. It's a strange world. ------------------------------------------- A Canadian: Let me be the first to congratulate you for writing a fine review. It's funny that you mentioned the JAV star Emiri looks like Rio; when you sent me the stills via e-mail to host for you, I actually thought that WAS Rio.

She could definitely pass for her twin sister. I don't follow Japanese bondage vids as much as used to, but I suspect she may be retired by now?

I know the shelf life for Japanese starlets is pretty short, probably much the same as their American counterparts. The direct link for your latest review is ------------------------------------------- SIM Researcher: A late tip of the hat for the addition of Milady & the Musketeers to the Hot Iron Database. Unfortunately, those 2 stills you posted may be the only record we'll have that there was a branding scene, since the movie appears to be out of print. At least, I came up with nothing in my efforts to find a copy anywhere online. ------------------------------------------- Lastly, anyone looking for a story that might very well turn your crank, check out Osouk's latest that he posted the link for earlier. This is really good stuff, particularly if you're into the political spy/interrogator conflict. Lots of wonderful dialogue in this one; very highly recommended by this perv.

Here's the direct link again for the story: 4524) A Canadian.